Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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33349 Replies
There are plenty of you in here for those toasts. I'm counting on you to do your part. Payback today was for the ones I'm toasting. The victims of the original attack. You know, what started this hell.
Yes, I think many people in here value Israeli and Palestinian lives equally. Pretty gross that you don’t. We’re also going to have to agree to disagree on when this started I’m afraid.
Na, operational excellence is a thing. Not all leaders are created equal. Just as there will never be another Trump or Putin anytime soon (huge cults of personality), not that good at what they do.
Sinwar is very hard to replace. So is Nasrallah.
And nobody is dancing. But it's a good day.
btw I hate Sinwar. But I respect the huge balls the man had, and his fight. You can't deny him that.
Hey guys, remember when OBL got killed and Al-Qaeda disappeared and no one ever hated America again?
well for this bet, no. bc he was killed in the South. strangely, it seems was in the field fighting. this thread told me that he was hiding in a tunnel with human shields and hostages and trying to negotiate his way to safety.
No, he was hiding behind a wall of few tens of thousands of civilians that the IDF had to get through first. No other way.
How very dissimilar to Netanyahu. Maybe someone should dispatch him off to the heavens too.
The slight difference is that sitting families down on their knees, and setting them on fire as you light the match. Or cutting someone's head off, or shooting an old lady in the face at point blank range, and then calling home to brag to mom and dad....Or killing a baby by hand in its crib...
There IS a difference. Not in outcome for that person's soul. But in something pretty tangible.
The slight difference is that sitting families down on their knees, and setting them on fire as you light the match. Or cutting someone's head off, or shooting an old lady in the face at point blank range, and then calling home to brag to mom and dad....Or killing a baby by hand in its crib...
There IS a difference. Not in outcome for that person's soul. But in something pretty tangible.
none of these things happened. well maybe the old lady story I havent looked into that one. you should stop spreading obv lies that were debunked ages ago.
btw wasn't this being Jew 'splained to us all not long ago?
Antisemitic incidents up 670% in Canada since October 7
Murder, arson and child harassment: New report reveals sharp rise in hate crimes against Jews in Canada following Israel-Hamas war, including recent shooting outside Jewish girls' school in Toronto during Yom Kippur
Despite Jews comprising only 1.4% of Canada’s population, they are the targets of 70% of hate crimes based on religion.
But like, it's just Zionism guys. Splain it to us.
The slight difference is that sitting families down on their knees, and setting them on fire as you light the match. Or cutting someone's head off, or shooting an old lady in the face at point blank range, and then calling home to brag to mom and dad....Or killing a baby by hand in its crib...
There IS a difference. Not in outcome for that person's soul. But in something pretty tangible.
While the vast majority of the people killed by the Israeli military have been killed impersonally and at a distance, there have been plenty of very up close and personal atrocities as well.
But, what is tangible about the difference? Like you said, it doesn't matter to the victim. I submit that the problem is that people don't feel much at all about deaths that happen from a distance much more than they feel too much about deaths that are up close and personal. It's not like there haven't been a lot of horrible horrible horrible deaths of people trapped under rubble. The impersonal nature of the killing is not a good thing. It's a bad thing. And it's compounded in this war with the AI targeting where humans feel even less responsible for the buttons they press.
While the vast majority of the people killed by the Israeli military have been killed impersonally and at a distance, there have been plenty of very up close and personal atrocities as well.
But, what is tangible about the difference? Like you said, it doesn't matter to the victim. I submit that the problem is that people don't feel much at all about deaths that happen from a distance much more than they feel too much about deaths that are up close and personal. It's not like there haven't bee
The main difference Micro, is that if Hamas and Hezbollah had done the initial plan on paper, which was to meet in Jerusalem, then "unlimited civilian deaths" is the number they'd take. All of them, if they could. If you put 100k Israeli women and children on the fence and told Hamas "GO!". You know what happens. You do know, somewhere inside you.
Israel has never wanted to kill all of them. A few right wing nuts, aside.
Put another way Micro, flip the situation.
How many aid trucks would Hamas send Israel?
Exactly.
The main difference Micro, is that if Hamas and Hezbollah had done the initial plan on paper, which was to meet in Jerusalem, then "unlimited civilian deaths" is the number they'd take. All of them, if they could. If you put 100k Israeli women and children on the fence and told Hamas "GO!". You know what happens. You do know, somewhere inside you.
Israel has never wanted to kill all of them. A few right wing nuts, aside.
You tell yourself this to justify the endless massacres of children in cold blood.
The main difference Micro, is that if Hamas and Hezbollah had done the initial plan on paper, which was to meet in Jerusalem, then "unlimited civilian deaths" is the number they'd take. All of them, if they could. If you put 100k Israeli women and children on the fence and told Hamas "GO!". You know what happens. You do know, somewhere inside you.
Israel has never wanted to kill all of them. A few right wing nuts, aside.
This is exactly the talk people gave about South Africa. While people are being bombed, occupied, having their borders controlled and their calories counted - for their entire lives, you're not going to get the most friendly attitudes. Israel will never move forward through war anymore than the white South Africans moved forward through Apartheid.
And if Israel's existence were actually threatened and most Israelis actually had a reasonable expectation of getting hit by bombs and were not in their shelters with an iron dome behind a military a thousand times more powerful than their opponents, would they be less inclined to want to kill all Palestinians or more? Wouldn't there be a few more right wing nuts?
The main difference Micro, is that if Hamas and Hezbollah had done the initial plan on paper, which was to meet in Jerusalem, then "unlimited civilian deaths" is the number they'd take. All of them, if they could. If you put 100k Israeli women and children on the fence and told Hamas "GO!". You know what happens. You do know, somewhere inside you.
Israel has never wanted to kill all of them. A few right wing nuts, aside.
this is pretty much indistinguishable from the racist trope that has been used for centuries to justify Western conquest, expansion, and extermination. maybe you dont mean it that way. but its the trope nonetheless.
I tell myself that one is a UN member, that has successfully made peace with numerous willing Arab neighbours every time the opportunity presented itself. And one is an internationally recognized terrorist organization, a part of the ring of fire, whose stated goals are to "take it back".
I don' t have to tell myself anything though. These are just the facts. And a solid part of this thread also gets it.
Almost no one in Gaza was an adult before it was controlled by Israel. Only like a quarter were adults when Hamas took power. What do you expect people growing up under those conditions to think of Israelis? How do you expect them to ever think differently about Israel?
These problems are so obvious that I think the only realistic people on the right are people like Luciom who just openly call for exterminating everyone who you are fighting. Everyone else's plan is just to murder some of them forever?
