Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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33350 Replies
I tell myself that one is a UN member, that has successfully made peace with numerous willing Arab neighbours every time the opportunity presented itself. And one is an internationally recognized terrorist organization, a part of the ring of fire, whose stated goals are to "take it back".
I don' t have to tell myself anything though. These are just the facts. And a solid part of this thread also gets it.
Israel has made arrangements with the horrible autocratic regimes around them because they have common interests.
Israel has made arrangements with the horrible autocratic regimes around them because they have common interests.
Yeah, not constantly being at war is a decent common interest, among others.
Sadat came direct to the Knesset in '77 because at least he had vision.
Mohammed bin Salman has the same vision. They put it in a handy little document too. https://www.vision2030.gov.sa/en
Mohammed bin Salman has the same vision. They put it in a handy little document too. https://www.vision2030.gov.sa/en
SA's biggest adversary is Iran. They compete on the global market for oil and directly for control of the Persian Gulf. And SA has a not entirely happy Shia minority who are actually the majority in the regions with the most oil in SA.
SA's biggest adversary is Iran. They compete on the global market for oil and directly for control of the Persian Gulf. And SA has a not entirely happy Shia minority who are actually the majority in the regions with the most oil in SA.
We both know that I know that. And we both know that normalization and peace is a lot more complicated than just "Iran bad".
The Saudis deradicalized, to their benefit. They believe the whole region can too. You also know this.
Marjorie Taylor Greene esque?
Iran tried deradicalizing and then the US/UK overthrew their government.
There are plenty of you in here for those toasts. I'm counting on you to do your part. Payback today was for the ones I'm toasting. The victims of the original attack. You know, what started this hell.
It started this particular round, but, as you know, the whole thing goes back a way. And it was the Israelis who chose to make it quite as hellish as it's been, to so little strategic effect that, as late as yesterday, they claimed that it was Hamas that was holding back aid supplies, implying a remarkable degree of Hamas control of the territory despite everything. (I don't think this claim was made in good faith, but they did make it.)
Then they cornered and killed Sinwar, an important success, not by one of those ludicrous AI-generated air strikes, or by deliberately bombing a 'safe area' they'd just sent people to, guessing that terrorist leaders would head there -- no, they caught him by chance, just through basic, effective patrolling on the ground, which is the way they should have gone about the whole thing in the first place if they were going to do it at all.
btw wasn't this being Jew 'splained to us all not long ago?
Antisemitic incidents up 670% in Canada since October 7
Murder, arson and child harassment: New report reveals sharp rise in hate crimes against Jews in Canada following Israel-Hamas war, including recent shooting outside Jewish girls' school in Toronto during Yom Kippur
Despite Jews comprising only 1.4% of Canada’s population, they are the targets of 70% of hate crimes based on religion.
But like,
how many have died in Canada since October 7th because of antisemitism ?
We've got the active duty IDF in this thread who acknowledged that they set up free fire zones where they shoot anything that moves.
this is fairly nasty btw misrepresenting the guy while he's banned. jokes on you though as it seems he used his time-out from this thread to go kill the leader of the terrorist organisation hamas
We both know that I know that. And we both know that normalization and peace is a lot more complicated than just "Iran bad".
The Saudis deradicalized, to their benefit. They believe the whole region can too. You also know this.
The Saudis never deradicalized. Their leadership accepted deals with the US because they had a lot to lose and it was in their interest to have tacit US military support. The Gazans, on the other hand, have (now literally) nothing to lose, so Israel is going to have to take some very extreme actions to get the situation under control.
And this is exactly the strategy of leaders like Sinwar. Keep up the resistance, and, knowing that Israel will never make concessions and always resort to coercive tactics, force them to escalate to the point where only the most die-hard pro-Israelis are still on their side.
Do you think young American voters are going to forget about this? Is the Israeli lobby so powerful that it doesn't matter?
What is your view of how Israeli deals with the long-term problems it's currently creating?
The slight difference is that sitting families down on their knees, and setting them on fire as you light the match. Or cutting someone's head off, or shooting an old lady in the face at point blank range, and then calling home to brag to mom and dad....Or killing a baby by hand in its crib...
There IS a difference. Not in outcome for that person's soul. But in something pretty tangible.
insanity
The Saudis never deradicalized. Their leadership accepted deals with the US because they had a lot to lose and it was in their interest to have tacit US military support. The Gazans, on the other hand, have (now literally) nothing to lose, so Israel is going to have to take some very extreme actions to get the situation under control.
And this is exactly the strategy of leaders like Sinwar. Keep up the resistance, and, knowing that Israel will never make concessions and always resort to coercive
former leaders
they didnt even charge him
sounds like they are having a look at his ipad to see if he was being a naughty lad, perhaps charges will follow
The Saudis never deradicalized. Their leadership accepted deals with the US because they had a lot to lose and it was in their interest to have tacit US military support. The Gazans, on the other hand, have (now literally) nothing to lose, so Israel is going to have to take some very extreme actions to get the situation under control.
And this is exactly the strategy of leaders like Sinwar. Keep up the resistance, and, knowing that Israel will never make concessions and always resort to coercive
Google "Saudi Deradicalization program"
I don't care which study you read. Any of them.
looks like his most recent piece is about how it was actually israel who killed all the civilians on 7 oct. i mean if thats what he's willing to put out there with his name on it i wouldn't be surprised if his ipad is full of very naughty stuff indeed
No, that's not true.
You can go to prison for espousing violence against people or fomenting racial hatred, but your views are not per se punishable in law.
Sorry your girl got sent down today for 2 1/2 years. Shocked to find that an IDF supporter turns out to be a supporter of racist speech.
It started this particular round, but, as you know, the whole thing goes back a way. And it was the Israelis who chose to make it quite as hellish as it's been, to so little strategic effect that, as late as yesterday, they claimed that it was Hamas that was holding back aid supplies, implying a remarkable degree of Hamas control of the territory despite everything. (I don't think this claim was made in good faith, but they did make it.)
Then they cornered and killed Sinwar, an important success
I’d imagine much of the IDF’s prior military operations set the conditions for Sinwar to be above ground and vulnerable to a random patrol. Israel has now taken out Hamas’ and Hezbollah’s entire leadership, both in under a years time. I’m no expert, but I get the impression that they know what they are doing. Probably a big reason why the US is so keen to uphold military relations with Israel.
I'm old enough to remember when people in this thread said there'd be no ethnic cleansing in Gaza or settlement by Israelis.
‘It is doable’: 10 Likud MKs to attend conference calling for ‘resettling Gaza’
I’d imagine much of the IDF’s prior military operations set the conditions for Sinwar to be above ground and vulnerable to a random patrol. Israel has now taken out Hamas’ and Hezbollah’s entire leadership, both in under a years time. I’m no expert, but I get the impression that they know what they are doing. Probably a big reason why the US is so keen to uphold military relations with Israel.
I think everybody disregards what can be done when it's your home you're defending. And not some place thousands of miles away. So the comps to places like Iraq and Afghanistan were never apt.
