Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
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The bolded is exactly my point. There are degrees of helping that don't mean completely overthrowing the enemy of the group they are helping.
Apply this to ukraine: USA is not an ally to Ukraine because they haven't marched on Moscow.
Iran and North Korea are not allies to Russia because Russia has not co.pletely conquered Ukraine.
The point is the Houthis are not Palestinians "allies" in any meaningful sense of the word. At most, they are just fellow traveler dysfunctional, antisocial socieites that are being manipulated to bolster the IRI, with no real benefit to their own societies.
For Hamas, at least their top leaders are getting fabulously rich through the resistance by plundering aid and black market shenanigans. The Houthis I dont think are even getting this. All indications they are just true believers in their interpretation of Islam, and see their actions as fulfilling Allah's will.
They might not be in a position to directly aid each, but that does not mean they are not allies. Houthis causing problems in their region does help Gazs indirectly.
I have no idea what to make of the second paragraph, seems like you just want to call Hamas corrupt which is in no way being denied. (At least by me)
The bolded is exactly my point. There are degrees of helping that don't mean completely overthrowing the enemy of the group they are helping.
Apply this to ukraine: USA is not an ally to Ukraine because they haven't marched on Moscow.
Iran and North Korea are not allies to Russia because Russia has not co.pletely conquered Ukraine.
What's the help Gaza palestinians gets if shipping stuff to Europe is more expensive? I don't get the connection.
It adds pressure to stabilize the region, which includes Gaza. The rhetoric behind the Houthi's escalation (as doubtful as I am of it) especially adds pressure by linking it directly to Gaza.
It’s not the first nor will be the last time Hamas shot at aid workers. Blocking, obstructing, and redirecting any aid they could not take credit for has been a part of Hamas’ MO since before they came into power in Gaza.
I’ll admit the Houthis are doing more than I thought. However, I still don’t think Hamas and the Palestinians have allies as much as there are simply other countries aligned against the west who are happy to arm militants and watch them die.
I’ll admit the Houthis are doing more than I thought. However, I still don’t think Hamas and the Palestinians have allies as much as there are simply other countries aligned against the west who are happy to arm militants and watch them die.
i read something about the houthis teaming up with Somali pirates and that's why they achieve more results, not sure how much tra true or precisely reported though
ya its a total mystery what the Yemenis objectives are. they only say it every chance they get.
ya its a total mystery what the Yemeni's objectives are. they only say it every chance they get.
it's not all Yemeni, it's a rebel group not representative at all of the whole Yemeni population.
the official government of Yemen is another entity distinct from the terrorist houthis.
but ofc as in every single event on the planet, you side with the bad guys
Ansar Allah is far more popular than the Western backed comprador government.
Obviously, Victor would prefer it if the US stopped being complicit in war crimes. Somehow you've managed to twist yourself into a pretzel in order to argue that giving Israel more bombs will result in fewer deaths, it's just candyland nonsense on its face.
Obviously, Victor would prefer it if the US stopped being complicit in war crimes.
I would also prefer this. Which is why we need to stop giving unconditional aid to groups like Hamas and Houthis, who use it to commit war crimes. Suicidal empathy for bad actors who are the enemy of all humanity is not a virtue.
Logically,the first thing we should do is give Hamas precision-guided munitions so they stop with these unguided rockets that indiscriminately hit civilians.
Logically,the first thing we should do is give Hamas precision-guided munitions so they stop with these unguided rockets that indiscriminately hit civilians.
Well, they are encouraging the West Bank to resort to suicide bombing, so if Jihadis murdering Jewish civilians is something you think will make things better than you may get your wish.
The Bedouin Arab hostage rescued by the IDF? His
It's disgraceful that the IDF continues to use human shields by placing its HQ next to a civilian hospital, perhaps if the US gave Hamas precision weapons, the number of civilian deaths could be minimized.
Obviously, Victor would prefer it if the US stopped being complicit in war crimes. Somehow you've managed to twist yourself into a pretzel in order to argue that giving Israel more bombs will result in fewer deaths, it's just candyland nonsense on its face.
I see you’ve met BGP. He’s used this logic before. I recommend agreeing to disagree
The Bedouin Arab hostage rescued by the IDF? His
also the far right wants to send him back to Gaza after their mainstream news intentionally misquoted/mistranslated him.
The Bedouin Arab hostage rescued by the IDF? His
Why dont you and some of your friends go start a village on US national park land and see how that goes?
If anything, the problem is that Israel is too lenient in looking the other way and allowing unauthorized Beduin villages without any infrastructure. Like all countries that follow building and zoning laws, Israel cannot legally provide infrastructure, but they also want to respect Beduin semi sovereignty so they often just look the other way, which creates its own host of problems.
And then when they eventually try to relocate the villages to places where they can actually legally provide infrastructure, bad faith actors jump in off the top rope to mischaracterize what is going on.
Obviously, Victor would prefer it if the US stopped being complicit in war crimes. Somehow you've managed to twist yourself into a pretzel in order to argue that giving Israel more bombs will result in fewer deaths, it's just candyland nonsense on its face.
I would also prefer this and posted where I said it twice, and once that I know that you read. It seems like you both are intent on twisting yourselves into pretzels in order to dishonestly represent my arguments yet cry foul if I ask very simple questions which highlight your dishonesty.
I would also prefer this and posted where I said it twice, and once that I know that you read. It seems like you both are intent on twisting yourselves into pretzels in order to dishonestly represent my arguments yet cry foul if I ask very simple questions which highlight your dishonesty.
If the end result of your logic is that the US should give precision bombs to Israel, then the logic is faulty. That's a basic reductio ad absurdum analysis that even Vic can work out.
Explain the faulty logic.
Do you know how "reductio ad absurdum" works? Your conclusion is so nonsensical on its face that the exercise of working through your sophistry is unnecessary.
It's like if I say "If we give the alcoholic a six-pack of beer, maybe he'll drink less." You don't have to walk through my reasoning to realize there's something wrong with it. We should not be supplying arms to the country that's bombing refugees and aid workers.
Do you know how "reductio ad absurdum" works? Your conclusion is so nonsensical on its face that the exercise of working through your sophistry is unnecessary.
It's necessary, you're just unable to do it.
It's like if I say "If we give the alcoholic a six-pack of beer, maybe he'll drink less." You don't have to walk through my reasoning to realize there's something wrong with it.
No, it's not like this at all.
We should not be supplying arms to the country that's bombing refugees and aid workers.
Which I have addressed multiple times, and you have apparently read. Yet here we are.
Do you want to minimize civilian casualties or no? Stop the mental gymnastics, answering this question explains the entire thing better than whatever it is I just read.
