LeBron > Jordan GOAT Super AIDS Containment, solved #22999 post by Matt R. (addendum #23174)

maximizing career championship equity and you don't pick the guy that is still around 3rd team all-nba in year 20, and didn't skip 5 seasons come on, Lebron is far and away the alltime leader in career title equity(at least in the post 8 team league era)

The current Mount Rushmore of the NBA: Robert Parish, Vince Carter, Kevin Willis, LeBron James. Open and shut case boys.

Also what the hell happened in this thread and why is unemployedybar trying to dig into poster family dynamics with their mom and dad. I know LeBron James is important but c’mon guys this is really weird.

Welcome Back Matt

Alternative rebuttal (it’s honestly hard to pick just one with you guys and your world class arguments):

How on earth does LeBron James only have 4 titles in TWENTY YEARS of playing while superteam hopping multiple times, yet Jordan had 6 in 15 years of playing, intermixed with multiple years of time off due to a broken foot and retirement and the rust that entails when coming back.

Maybe if LeBron plays for 30 years he will catch Jordan but who knows right? He might run out of future hall of famers to play with.

Alternatively Kevin Willis and Robert Parish can come out of retirement, they can combine their longevities with LeBron, and they can get one more title (the goal of basketball. For those of you that have actually played sports competitively you would intuitively understand that).

Still would be one behind Jordan (while LeBron would have like 6+ more seasons played at that point). But he would be a little closer at least.

That would automatically be the GOAT team though. Because as you all know we sum longevities to figure out who the best basketball players are. And that makes sense and is not really stupid. I swear you guys do have the best arguments. Being serious.

Still like to dip in a few times a year and check the thread status lol. Seems like the LePlorables are going off the deep end lately though. Sad state of affairs. Weirds me out a bit how invested they are.

LeBron James is good at basketball guys. It’s ok. I’m sure your familial relationships are all wonderful. Carry on.

4 championship in 20 years is better then 6 championship in 15 ?
U know how equity works ?
Hell about kareem having 6 titles , he could had more if he didn’t had to play in college ….
38 years old kareem was 1st all nba and oh yeah , was playing 79 games not half a season like LeBron …
Won 2 titles at 39 and 40 .
Taking your flawed calculation I’m taking Kareem before LeBron ….
I’m
Taking both guys that actually have more titles .

you can be an associate without going to a top school, but entry-level is anywhere from analyst to senior analyst to associate - it's all entry level - you work the same deals and report to a VP or MD.

I was just giving you a taste and figuring you'd shut up... But I've done all kinds of things.. I managed bank of america's corporate office space leases domestically for example - not the bank branches - the high-rises.. And I did the deals as well.

Notice how I don't ask you what you do because I don't care.. I can just stick to the thread because I'm on the right side, while you must derail because you made a mistake and fell for junior-high-level propaganda.. You fell for the shallow propaganda because you understand the game on a shallow level.. Again, you should stop wasting your time trying to appreciate the game of basketball - you clearly can't

If Player A can thee-peat and Player B cannot, then Player A's ability to 3-peat provides more title equity than Player B's ability to be 3rd team in year 20

Player A won 6 titles in 7 years, while Player B went 1/4 with every lineup that we put around him, except the Allen miracle allowed 2/4

There is no way Lebron's 1/4 ring frequency in his prime provides more title equity than Jordan's 6/7 ring frequency in his prime, regardless of who is still All-NBA at 38.

Peak ability and the resulting massive edge in ring frequency provides more title equity than longevity, in this case (and probably most cases).

The instant MJ got 1 all-star, he didn't lose 3 straight games for 9 years - this shows more invincibility and title equity than Lebron's longevity or weak ring frequency in his prime despite more help, aka 5 seasons with 2 all-star teammates (zero for MJ) and a 34 to 9 edge in top 5 draft pick teammates.

LeBron further extends his #1 GOAT status half way through this season.

All-nba 2nd team level player at 39 years old and year 21 >>>>>>>>> What Jordan was at 39 years old.

The days where Jordan can claim to be the undisputed GOAT are dead. It's never happening anymore.

We won.

Fallguy had the right idea 10 years ago:

You saw it with your own eyes even 10 years ago fallguy, just accept it now. Jordan is inferior.

Proposal to start a new thread:

GOAT point guard, John Stockton or John Stockton?

Not only has he played m0re seasons in the same way LeBron James has the play m0re seasons award. He was also better than Magic Johnson, for example, at 39 years old.

This is why all the basketball analysts who have played sports before have John Stockton > Magic Johnson. It’s no debate, really. Shut the thread down, the Cheeto Xbox nba 2k simulation is definitive.

This would be a good idea for you to start a thread and discuss Stockton vs Stockton. Let us know how that goes and where the discussion takes you. Hopefully you learn something useful that you can share with us.

You were devastated when Ray Allen hit that 3 in game 6. I would suggest analyzing deep down why it was painful for you. You might also realize your opinion on GOAT status is massively biased towards the emotional side.

It isn't Tennis, they have teammates, and there are other factors that influence titles. GSW getting to pay Curry nothing so they could add prime Durant to an already stacked team, none of the Bulls teams beat 2017 GSW

and yeah Kareem probably has more title equity than Jordan too, an extra 5 seasons is a lot, it doesn't mean everyone that played 19 seasons is better than Jordan, but if the peaks are close an extra 5 years is a big deal.

you think a competent organization results in KG only winning a single ring?

there are a lot of moving pieces, Lebron in year 20+ could be a key piece of a championship team, Jordan at this age despite half of decade of skipped seasons was washed

Imagine if MJ had better teammates than pippen , he probably would had 3 3peated .

U got massive equity losing vs mavs with 3 HoF yeah …
What’s makes u think lebron reaching finals would win anyway ?

U would pass over magic because he only played 11 season with 5 titles And 9 finals ?
That’s championship equity !

Yeah it’s team sports bla bla..funny wherever MJ went he won !
At the age of lebron MJ was still playing all games buddy , even injured …

Like I said , I’m taking guys that actually did it instead of guys that should have or might of ……
I’m taking the guy that seem not cracking under pressure in finals either .

Ps: the leagues is a joke today how easy it is to play and cumulate great stats.
2 guys with 70 pts last week, ah yes Defense today is much harder lol…
Mj would thrive in an era like this one even more ….

There is no way you would choose Stockton over magic even tho Stockton is all time high in history in assist , steals.
and was able to play at a high level later on while magic couldn’t play at all.
Stop it.

When peaks are near the same we start incorporating longevity more and more. Bran's peaks + longevity is just too large for Jordan to overcome.

Nah…
How many time I hear during lebron peak Kobe was equal/better by many people or that KD was equal to lebron later on ?

During all mj peak no one was near mj , just no one….

Lebron peak ain’t mj peak no way .
2 3 peat in 7 years while being the best scorer of the league and first team defensive ?
Nop not close .
It’s not nostalgia it’s just remembering correctly.
Your old , u have a fading memory or the start of Alzheimer’s :p

I was devastated at the time because I was looking forward to laughing at another Lebron choke (23 on 43% thru 6 games)

It would've been another historic upset meltdown like 2011 and 2010, or the original upset in 2009 ECF where the Magic were one of the 10 biggest underdogs to ever win a playoff series - they had the injury excuse but still won because (1) lebron decided to guard Courtney Lee instead of providing the size/agility to guard Hedo - worst defensive decision of all-time 2) 7 TO in 4th quarter of critical Game four 3) completely dominated by a non-top 75 player in the Game 4 OT that swung the series 4) too ball-dominant at 38 ppg so he never beat a top 5 SRS or Finals team while carrying scoring load, aka weak scoring & efficiency from sidekick (zero carry-jobs vs top teams in 2 decades).

But again, Ray Allen saved Lebron from this type of objective scrutiny by hitting the biggest shot in Finals history (followed by Kyrie's shot and then MJ Game 6).

Regardless, Lebron only averaged 25 on 45% overall in the 13' Finals and the Heat didn't win with him on the floor because Lebron had zero plus/minus and negative net rating for the series - teammates actually staved off an 0-3 deficit as Diaw locked up Lebron for 16 on 39% thru 3 games, which required Ray Allen to force Game 7.. Lebron was remarkably locked down in this fashion despite having an equal usage and scoring partner to attract equal defensive attention, so Lebron never defeated maximum defensive attention (never carried scoring load on championship level).. These metrics would make the 13' Finals the worst series of Jordan's career, let alone Finals.. Again, Ray saved Lebron from these facts about his capacity for choking coming to light.

Actually, it's emotional and not objective or math-oriented to ignore that Lebron was a couple bounces away from only 2 rings and 2/10 championship record - teammate bailouts prevented this, aka anomalous luck.. this demonstrates that he's inflated at #2 all-time, perhaps by quite a bit.. he's the only guy in history that decided to team-up with opposing franchise players to win because the Moses and KG transactions were GM-driven (the players didn't decide to do it).

Of course, the question is why does prime Lebron have a penchant for bad blowout losses or sweeps to top teams, regardless of cast?.. it's due to inferior brand of ball and not inferior talent, since he's had bad losses (sweeps, record losses, upset losses) with every cast and to every opponent - all in his prime.
.

Who said peak Kobe was better than Bron? You?

Who said KD was equal to Bron? You?

Total bullshit.

From 2012-2020 Nobody was considered better than Bron. That's 9 years.

You just make up random **** as you go along.

Everything you say on this topic is massively biased towards your negative emotions towards Bron.

We know.

fallguy

Was Kyrie Irvings 3 in 2016 devastating for you? If you are a non biased observer of the game the answer should be no.

I know Matt R. was deeply deeply upset about 2016. He and you need to dig deep down and analyze why that is the case.

Re the Embiid explosion lately, I have long thought I remembered him having back spasms in the Final Four, and then becoming a bit suspect about his prospects of being injury prone in regard to the back. I just realized tonight that Embiid was never in a Final Four. It was Emeka Okafor I was thinking about with the youthful ominous back trouble that did come to roost.

if u start from 2012 ok nvm kobe tho he was still 1st nba but started to fade in D.
lebron was already faded for some years in 2020
gianis for example in 2019-2020

i often hear kd in 17-18 was as good as lebron.

doesnt matter if they are right , the narrative was there.
there absolutely didnt had any narrative against mj , none.