Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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And they will be held accountable by the people living well adjusted lives. While Hamas will continue to “exist”, sleeping in their own feces underground.
worked for the Vietnamese
Like any terrorist organization, Hamas doomed itself to failure when they defined the objective of their people as extermination of a religious/ethnic/ national group. I can’t think of another example where a terrorist group has been successful with an objective such as that. Basing your entire existence an eradicating another group of people is the most base form of humanity, irrespective of your starting point.
Very few people itt care about Hamas. The problem is most people are not willing to pay the human price to put Hamas into such a state. If you look at things as purely Hamas vs Israel and ignore the millions caught in the middle, then you are largely missing the conflict.
It could be bullshit I guess, but Israel and US media are reporting Sinwar wants a ceasefire and the expectation is there should be one shortly. It is quite possible that we dont really have any grasp of Hamas internal politics, and Haniyeh was an impediment.
Although it is hard to believe that was the main reason the Haniyeh hit was authorized. It seems reasonable to assume Israel is/was trying to provoke Iran into a wider conflict; probably because the status quo of Iran using proxies to wear down Israel is unsustainable to Israel. So instigating a wider conflict that possibly draws Iran and the US directly in and gets some sort of resolution one way or another might be seen as preferable to Netanyahu's govt.
Ok, Victor and DouleBrunsonFan, take a timeout until 12:00 Eastern Time, the next snipey thing said by either of you is going to be a 24 hour ban
And a BUNCH of you need to PULL BACK the inflammatory rhetoric. It’s enough.
It could be bullshit I guess, but Israel and US media are reporting Sinwar wants a ceasefire and the expectation is there should be one shortly. It is quite possible that we dont really have any grasp of Hamas internal politics, and Haniyeh was an impediment.
Although it is hard to believe that was the main reason the Haniyeh hit was authorized. It seems reasonable to assume Israel is/was trying to provoke Iran into a wider conflict; probably because the status quo of Iran using proxies to we
You're missing the obvious explanation Hamas will starve if Iran and Hizbollah go into open conflict with Israel.
Sinwar wants the attention on Hamas and Hamas only. He is a madman but he is not stupid. He knows Iran will prioritize itself and Hizbollah over Hamas.
Israel's finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, has said the starvation of millions of Gazans might be “justified and moral”.
Someone should send him a link to this forum.
He also said that starving the Gazans would have ended the war a long time ago. Many thousands of lives would have been spared. There are no good options in war.
There is also the cynical view that this whole war was about Sinwar killing the existing political leadership so he finally gets his turn at embezzling billions of dollars.
There is also the cynical view that this whole war was about Sinwar killing the existing political leadership so he finally gets his turn at embezzling billions of dollars.
Sinwar spent years in Israeli jail. He has the entire Koran memorized. Everyone in Israel who knew him is very confident he is very sincere in his belief he is fighting a Holy War, and isn't cynical; at least not in this regard.
You're missing the obvious explanation Hamas will starve if Iran and Hizbollah go into open conflict with Israel.
Sinwar wants the attention on Hamas and Hamas only. He is a madman but he is not stupid. He knows Iran will prioritize itself and Hizbollah over Hamas.
It is being reported Sinwar is demanding Israeli troops leave Gaza. I dont know what the proposal the US, Qatar, Egypt and Israel have all agreed to, but it is hard to imagine that is one of the terms.
I dont think we can overstate how important it is for Hamas to regain control of the border and the smuggling tunnels. It is how they get their weapons, and just as important they tax all the smuggling so it is a major source of income.
Israel taking control of the Rafah crossing gave them tremendous leverage to keep the war going to achieve their military aims; which is why the Biden regime was trying to hard to block them from doing this. 1.) Members of the Biden regime are clearly sympathetic to Hamas (Biden's top analyst was the president of his SJP chapter, and 2.) The Biden's team strategy is to put pressure on Israel to ceasefire, so anything giving Israel leverage is bad for this strategy.
? other way round
--
US official warns of ‘quite significant consequences’ for Iran if it strikes Israel
oof
iran/hez have been such a disappointment through all this for hamas and their supporters. if you go back to the first few pages of this thread there is undisguised excitement over the prospect of hezbollah's upcoming massacre of israeli civlians on the northern boarder. but other than those football kids, they've just spent the whole war posting videos of google maps
I don't know how to explain this any better: Haniyeh could be the second more evil person on earth, if the choice is between him or the most evil on person then compared to that one person he's relatively good.
no
no. not even close. It means he is relatively better, or less evil. Less evil could mean that he is more good. But he is not relatively good. They are both evil, one less so. That does not make him good, relative or otherwise.
I mean, cmon, seriously
Your constant semantic arguments are always irrelevant and incorrect. On the scale of good and evil less evil is more towards good...
It's all irrelevant, my point in that post is extremely clear and there was no confusion from anyone it was directed towards.
Doyle: I think you are correct. Let me know when Hamas is eliminated and I'll admit my assumption was wrong.
that's not what you said Tho.
theres an important distinction here, maybe you missed it? You said you can compare to evil people and one is relatively good.
thats not true, and its not semantics. one is less evil, that doesnt make them relatively good.
Are you saying that what you said is correct? That between two people who arent equivalently evil, one is relatively good?
The problem is that most sane people realize that the true aim of pro Palestine leftism is literal destruction of Western civilization. They are horrible, spoiled, pretentious people that all normies are rightfully disgusted and repulsed by.
Pro Palestinian leftist shitheads (and Islamists who openly cheer on IRI, Hezbollah and Hamas) are the greatest asset the Israeli right has. We see these horrible people and their horrible anti-civilizational rhetoric and impulsively all we want is to unconditionally support Israel.
Harris knows what a complete political liability these people are. The Trump campaign really seems to be faltering, so the far left acting up really is the Republicans best shot. If Republicans were smart they would be covertly trying to support the far left (the way Democrats do). But being smart is something no one has accused the Republican Party of.
its so weird to say the Dems support the far left. the far left are the only people they hate more than conservatives. well not the only people, they hate poor foreigners more.
The problem is that most sane people realize that the true aim of pro Palestine leftism is literal destruction of Western civilization. They are horrible, spoiled, pretentious people that all normies are rightfully disgusted and repulsed by.
Pro Palestinian leftist shitheads (and Islamists who openly cheer on IRI, Hezbollah and Hamas) are the greatest asset the Israeli right has. We see these horrible people and their horrible anti-civilizational rhetoric and impulsively all we want is to unc
I tried to a while to get a measure of how many they are, per country, but it's hard. Definition is quirky and mainstream doesn't agree with our definition. And i am not talking about generic "Israel should respond differently" critics, i am talking people who chant "from river to the sea" or worse.
How many do you guesstimate want to abolish Israel as a country, and deport all jews from the area, in the USA?
I tried to a while to get a measure of how many they are, per country, but it's hard. Definition is quirky and mainstream doesn't agree with our definition. And i am not talking about generic "Israel should respond differently" critics, i am talking people who chant "from river to the sea" or worse.
How many do you guesstimate want to abolish Israel as a country, and deport all jews from the area, in the USA?
Genuinely or anyone who who chants ''from the river to the sea'' is part of that group also?
I'm asking because 99% of the college kids who chanted that **** didn't even know what river or what sea, they're just there because it's ''exciting''.
edit: not excusing ignorance, just saying I doubt these people care about Israel existing or not.
Genuinely or anyone who who chants ''from the river to the sea'' is part of that group also?
I'm asking because 99% of the college kids who chanted that **** didn't even know what river or what sea, they're just there because it's ''exciting''.
edit: not excusing ignorance, just saying I doubt these people care about Israel existing or not.
From river to the sea means to give all that land to palestinians and to eliminate Israel as a state yes.
It isn't technically necessarily a call for genocide, but at least for deportations of all jews from the area. And no i don't believe they don't know that is the meaning, as they talk about intifada as well and so on.
