Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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30514 Replies
Some have blamed them. We had posts on how they voted for hamas etc
Moving past that. I'm happy we agree they are innocent victims. I dont accept that 'military target' is near sufficient justification for destroying inncocent people. I also think there's a stretching of military objectives and I'm very dubious that sufficient care is being taken. I believe this is why netanyahu is so damaging to israels standing in the world and why so many object. It's not antisemitism - it's horror that a demo
The Palestinian people are not "innocent victims". They may have been brain washed, but as a people they still largely agree with the goal of destroying Israel (you know, that whole 'river to the sea' rallying cry). So, they are complicit.
For example*:
The Palestinian people in Gaza elected Hamas.
Two-thirds of Gaza respondents said they continue to support the Hamas-led Oct. 7 attack on Israel. Apparently that is because many do not believe Hamas committed atrocities on this day. In fact, about 90% or so of Palestinians do not believe that Hamas committed atrocities. One could argue that this is a sign of them being brain washed, but it does not change the fact that through their support of Hamas they are complicit.
About half of those responding to the survey in Gaza said they expected Hamas to win the war with Israel and return to rule the Gaza Strip. That's not innocent. Crazy maybe, but not innocent.
In the June 12 poll, 40% of Palestinians in both the West Bank and Gaza said they would prefer Hamas to govern them. Although this is less than the majority, it is a high number and apparently many who do not want Hamas to govern are still quite happy with Hamas attacking Israel. Because the people of Gaza think that an option exists other than peace.
The Palestinian people need to be willing to accept the right of Israel to exist, and need to agree to permanently give up all military ambitions. Innocent people would want to do this, but most Gazans don't want to do this. The peace process has always been pointless and a non-starter as a result of this. If the Palestinian people continue to refuse to live in peace next to Israel, they will continue to be pushed from the sea to the river. Without peace, there can only be one winner. Anyone in the world encouraging the Palestinians to think there is an option other than peace is more dangerous to the Palestinians than Israel.
*https://www.npr.org/2024/07/26/g-s1-1294...
*** useful to cite NPR here given that https://www.jewishvoicesnj.org/articles/...
Thank you. Saves me being asked to demonstrate that some blame the Palestinians.
Similarly some will blame all Israelis.
And it will inevitably lead to an increase in antisemitism and Islamophobia
Jesus. TIL victims of racially aggravated assault are probably lying.
all of the things that you guys initially called lies are now well documented in Israeli or Western media
-mass rape in torture camps
-human shields
-forced tunnel searches
-forced amputations on prisoners
-sniping children
-bombing hospitals
but sure maybe they are lying this time...
The issue is "they" just happen to be a Jewish student on a night out - beating someone up or accusing them of lying about it due to their race is the definition of racism
the "they" in my post is in reference to the Palestinian journalists that you yourself just called liars.
with regards to the bar fight, I tend to be pretty skeptical of one-sided accounts of 2am bar fights. sounds like you guys think we should just believe the guy simply bc hes Jewish, which tbh sounds kinda racist.
the "they" in my post is in reference to the Palestinian journalists that you yourself just called liars.
I was actually suggesting that you might not be entirely kosher by claiming, without evidence, that Israel were conducting weapons tests on Palestinians.
sounds like you guys think we should just believe the guy simply bc hes Jewish, which tbh sounds kinda racist.
Of course there are likely two sides to the story, but I don't think the default should be to not believe people when they claim to have been racially assaulted.
Yeah Vic everyone who calls you on your bullshit is the real racist. Probably have reading comprehension issues too.
You really are some piece of work I gotta say. Amazing that vlyou can get away with your victim bashing. Again absolutely disgusting behaviour too and don't think you're fooling anymore with your extermination comment either. You aren't.
the "they" in my post is in reference to the Palestinian journalists that you yourself just called liars.
with regards to the bar fight, I tend to be pretty skeptical of one-sided accounts of 2am bar fights. sounds like you guys think we should just believe the guy simply bc hes Jewish, which tbh sounds kinda racist.
it sounds like he was attacked for wearing a symbol that Israel has now made suggestive of supporting the extermination of people.
doesnt matter if he lied, what matters is you suggesting everyone wearing that star symbol is justified to get beat up....
a jew can wear that symbol and be against israel policies.
an amercian can travel the world and be agaisnt US present policies and so in your view everyone should be allowed to beat him up because of your pov on israel and the US ?
wtf...
but from a extremist like yourself yeah i guess it makes sense.
this is your nemesis:
I was actually suggesting that you might not be entirely kosher by claiming, without evidence, that Israel were conducting weapons tests on Palestinians.
Of course there are likely two sides to the story, but I don't think the default should be to not believe people when they claim to have been racially assaulted.
the testimony and reporting of many people in Gaza is enough evidence for me given their track record, and Israel's track record.
as for the alleged victim, my default in 2am bar fights is usually be to reserve judgment until more information comes out.
doesnt matter if he lied, what matters is you suggesting everyone wearing that star symbol is justified to get beat up....
a jew can wear that symbol and be against israel policies.
you really think a 23 yr old wearing that symbol to a late night club in late 2024 isnt showing support for Israel? cmon man.
and no, that doesnt mean he should get beat up. if it was me I would stay far away from the guy fearing he just got back from Gaza.
you really think a 23 yr old wearing that symbol to a late night club in late 2024 isnt showing support for Israel? cmon man.
and no, that doesnt mean he should get beat up. if it was me I would stay far away from the guy fearing he just got back from Gaza.
For some it's no different to a Christian wearing a cross.
The Palestinian people are not "innocent victims". They may have been brain washed, but as a people they still largely agree with the goal of destroying Israel (you know, that whole 'river to the sea' rallying cry). So, they are complicit.
For example*:
The Palestinian people in Gaza elected Hamas.
Two-thirds of Gaza respondents said they continue to support the Hamas-led Oct. 7 attack on Israel. Apparently that is because many do not believe Hamas committed atrocities on this day. In fact, about
I’m sorry but using quotation marks and thereby discrediting an entire population, many of whom are indeed innocent is completely and utterly disgusting.
One year on and nearly 100k people are dead. There are estimates the number is higher than suggested/portrayed in the media. Suggesting that not a single one of them is innocent is deeply disturbing, but on a positive note a very clear representation of how much of an ignoramus you actually are.
There are plenty of polls/surveys that show that the majority of Israelis think the response to Oct 7th has been adequate or even worse not strong enough. Given that so many people are dead, coupled with the blatant hatred and bigotry the Israeli society has shown us in their social and public media one could very well believe and in all likelihood rightfully so that it is Israel that refuses to accept peace and should be permanently demilitarized.
Feel free to actually read something and educate yourself, like for example the origins of the term “River to the sea” before calling the kettle black.
The Palestinian people are not "innocent victims". They may have been brain washed, but as a people they still largely agree with the goal of destroying Israel (you know, that whole 'river to the sea' rallying cry). So, they are complicit.
When you find yourself stumbling around for a reason to justify the mass-murder of civilians, that ought to be a real "are we the baddies?" moment.
OTOH, at least the conversation is becoming more honest: long gone are the promises that Israel would try to avoid civilian deaths and let people return to their homes after a quick anti-Hamas operation. Now it's rather openly stated that we have to wipe them out before they wipe us out.
Israeli centrist media. 52 violations in a few days.
interesting thing about the Hula massacre is that after murdering like 50 men the officer responsible went on to become a a very influential lawyer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hula_massa...
time is a flat circle or something like that I guess
Mod ruling- The Star of David has long been a symbol of Jewish identity, and it is therefore inappropriate at best and racist at worst to refer to such as a hate symbol.
I understand that the state of Israel has also chosen the symbol to be its emblem, and many now associate the symbol with Zionism which some find inappropriate. Nonetheless, it is not accurate or acceptable to refer to all wearers of the Star of David as supporters of Israel, so please avoid further inappropriate generalizations.
Feel free to PM me if you wish to discuss this ruling further. Thank you ♥
Mod ruling- The Star of David has long been a symbol of Jewish identity, and it is therefore inappropriate at best and racist at worst to refer to such as a hate symbol.
I understand that the state of Israel has also chosen the symbol to be its emblem, and many now associate the symbol with Zionism which some find inappropriate. Nonetheless, it is not accurate or acceptable to refer to all wearers of the Star of David as supporters of Israel, so please avoid further inappropriate generalizations
Amazing we need a mod to clarify this isn’t ?
Ps: and I’m Far being pro Israel …but I do use my brain and understand it .
