Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]
The new poster admitted he didn't know much about the subject and asked a good-faith question.
P.S. "You're a jerk." - Mark Twain*
*Well, I'm sure Twain said that to somebody at least once in his life.
I cant imagine how stupid you need to be to think a guy who walks into a thread 2 years into the genocide and blames the victims is acting in "good faith". but heres the thing, my response actually does entertain that idea by just assuming he is a fool and not a genocidal maniac like the supporters of Israel and their apologists of which you belong to the latter group.
I cant imagine how stupid you need to be to think a guy who walks into a thread 2 years into the genocide and blames the victims is acting in "good faith". but heres the thing, my response actually does entertain that idea by just assuming he is a fool and not a genocidal maniac like the supporters of Israel and their apologists of which you belong to the latter group.
I can confidently say that you're almost for sure the only person who as read my posts in this thread to conclude that I am an 'apologist for Israel.'
You are just being laughably stupid at this point. (In my humble opinion ofc)
anybody that puts any blame on Hamas or bleats on about antisemitism is def doing Israeli apologia.
anybody that puts any blame on Hamas or bleats on about antisemitism is def doing Israeli apologia.
Obviously, I'm an apologist for Israel:
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showp...
1. If you go by dead innocent civilians, Israel is more evil. Oct 7th was pure evil. on the part of Hamas The Israeli response was 'overkill'. Even a former Israeli PM has condemned the current Israeli goverment of sponsoring genocide.2. Buchanan has been of accused of anti-Semitism. Kinda like almost everyone else who criticizes Israel. Buchanan's antagonist on
notsureifserious
I guarentee your wall of texts are not ''by you'' .
You are fooling no one.
I was going with this one in response to our first time poster wondering if this was all the fault of Hamas
Twain was a fan of the Jewish people and Zionism. That being said, he actually was pessimistic that Israel would work, because the land the Jews were settling was so barren and the (non-Jewish) locals were so economically unproductive. But he of course underestimated the Jews perseverance and willingness of Jews to sacrifice, work hard and persevere; and turn a barren, desolate desert into the nation state of Israel.
that seemed to be einstein's take on it, more or less
also not sure if twain ever supported zionism, looks like he died around when it was becoming a thing. regardless, i'll go with einstein on this
anybody that puts any blame on Hamas or bleats on about antisemitism is def doing Israeli apologia.
Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Egypt join calls for Hamas to disarm and exit Gaza to end war with Israel
--You realize this is literally every govt in the world except for the IRGC and some of its proxies.
A lot of the suffering in Gaza should be attributed to Hamas if you grant them any agency in the choices they’ve made.
To debatable extents, more and more of the suffering is caused by Israel’s desire to maximize pain, or at the minimum, complete disregard for Palestinian welfare.
Israel can do better. They chose not to.
Is it Hamas who is annexing the strip to Israel?
Netanyahu Proposes Annexing Parts of Gaz...
Is it Hamas that is blocking aid trucks?
Is Hamas forbidding Gazans from fishing or even wading in the ocean?
Hamas is "orchestrating" genocide? Come on.
Very curious idea of agency you have.
Page up this thread for a few days. There is a massive amount of cited material.
No, but more relevant Hamas is the one that did 10/7 and has been holding hostages for 1.5 years as their city-state has been destroyed for it. And is viewed by the entire world as the single biggest impediment to peace*.
Even if you believe Netanyahu doesn't even want peace (which is a reasonable take) the fact that Hamas is doing what it is doing is giving him way too much leverage. Like I have said before, at some point we have to wonder if Hamas actually works for Netanyahu given how their actions seem to have perfectly played into giving him leverage to severely weaken the IRGC and their Arab paramilitaries.
*It really seems everyone, including all the Arab mediators, really though they had worked out a cease-fire and then Hamas did a last second pull-out, and it really may have been the final straw for even Qatar.
A lot of the suffering in Gaza should be attributed to Hamas if you grant them any agency in the choices they’ve made.
To debatable extents, more and more of the suffering is caused by Israel’s desire to maximize pain, or at the minimum, complete disregard for Palestinian welfare.
Israel can do better. They chose not to.
Well, depends on what the frame of reference is.
As much as it is fashionable to hate on Israel, if we take a 40,000 foot view of how Israel maneuvered events to give them the leverage to severely degrade the Axis of Resistance, completely alter the balance of power in the region, and the successes of intelligence and military operations; it would be hard to argue Israel could have done much better.
Of course, the 1 million dollar question (which none of us have the answer to at this point) is if the loss of worldwide good will will cause this to be a pyrrhic victory in the longer run.
Well, with respect that’s debatable. Note The amount of times that mainstream media sources have settled lawsuits due to erroneous reporting. Both left and right.
The bigger point is 95% of my posts are my own content. Plus I provided sources other than Google AI. The poster in question has made hit-and-run insult toward me which by the way I don’t care about, but that’s what he’s doing. It’s his way of avoiding responding directly to me and quoting the paragraphs of information I have wrote or the sources from msm
I must say though the few times I have used an image from Google AI it comments directly from the source It is quoting whether it’s pew or something else.
No, the Israelis are fairly frank about their wish to eliminate the population of Gaza. And they can afford to be, because no one is prepared to take military action against them, and military action is the only thing that will stop them.
That is what is really fascinating about this. You even now have the United Kingdom ready to recognize the Palestinian state which is incredible. Unless Israel negotiate a cease-fire. But that is about as close as we are getting to holding Israel accountable, which in other words is nothing.
We will sanction Russia, but not Israel. It’s pure hypocrisy. As we now even have scholars in Israel, telling the international world to sanction Israel for its war crimes in Gaza.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre...
At this point, the people defending the Netanyahu administration are pretty much the far right in Israel and their supporters , and politicians around the world.
But yes I mean who is going to come to the defense of the people of Gaza??? It is morally warranted at this point. We have American military personnel who have no connection to Israel or Palestine, who are neutral people who have been on the ground in Gaza and who have witnessed war crimes by the IDF. One of them a colonel in the US Army was removed from his position for criticizing Israeli policy. He has a friend in the IDF an officer who also has seen Israeli soldiers commit war crimes.
Pentagon Official FIRED Over Criticism Of Israel
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_wVJCwkVX7...
Former US Green Beret says Israel committed war crimes at Gaza food distribution site
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=72aZhsNMOW...
The Green beret was on the ground in Gaza. The guy has no reason to make this stuff up. Israeli policy towards supplying food in Gaza is evil. It is unlike how the United States handled its occupation of Iraq or Afghanistan. The green beret who has been in wars before fighting for the US military has said he has seen nothing like he has seen in Gaza wrt to how the IDF is handling the situation. Just in case pro Netanyahu people wanna do the what aboutism.
See part of the reason why countries perhaps will not come to the defense of the people of Gaza is because Israel is nuclear armed, and of course the politicians in America both Democrats and Republicans overwhelmingly support Israel no matter what. It’s pure lunacy morally speaking. As historically the United States has sent weapons to groups of people in countries all over the world. We could find people in Palestine that are not Hamas … good people fund them and send them weapons to defend themselves against Israeli aggression. It’s not done because of money and power.
The UK’s largest Jewish organisation has called for a “rapid, uninhibited, and sustained increase in aid through all available channels” in Gaza in a rare implicit criticism of the Israeli government.
The Board of Deputies held an emergency meeting on Tuesday evening amid growing horror among British Jews at the humanitarian crisis in Gaza, with children malnourished and starving and desperate parents being killed as they try to secure food for their families.
In a statement issued after the meeting, Phil Rosenberg, the board’s president, said the Israeli government’s recent moves to allow limited aid into Gaza in response to mounting international pressure was “long overdue”.
He said: “The suffering we are witnessing in the Gaza Strip demands a response. The new measures announced by Israeli authorities to address the humanitarian crisis are essential if long overdue.
“We need to see a rapid, uninhibited, and sustained increase in aid through all available channels, and we need to see all agencies cooperating in this endeavour. As we have been saying for months, food must not be used as a weapon of war, by any side in this conflict.”
Rosenberg’s statement came a month after the board took disciplinary action against 36 elected representatives who signed an open letter that was strongly critical of Israel’s actions in Gaza. Five of the 36 were suspended for two years.
Is it Hamas who is annexing the strip to Israel?
Netanyahu Proposes Annexing Parts of Gaz...
Is it Hamas that is blocking aid trucks?
Is Hamas forbidding Gazans from fishing or even wading in the ocean?
Hamas is "orchestrating" genocide? Come on.
Very curious idea of agency you have.
Page up this thread for a few days. There is a massive amount of cited material.
I'm just the rookie on this thread, but I would say that Hamas is absolutely committed to the genocide of Israeli jews. Isn't it in their constitution? I don't know much about the food trucks being blocked. Still, I can imagine that the Israelis would be cautious about the possibility of the food trucks actually containing arms or explosives. I would also have the same reservations about food trucks reaching Hamas and not the refugees. None of which answers my question about the remaining Israeli hostages being a solution
I'm curious as to why the British government would foist a solution onto the Palestinians that they clearly don't want. The Palestinians have had multiple opportunities for statehood and a two-state solution before and turned them all down.
I'm curious as to why the British government would foist a solution onto the Palestinians that they clearly don't want. The Palestinians have had multiple opportunities for statehood and a two-state solution before and turned them all down.
I think most Palestinian's want their own nation; at this point they really have no choice either way now that Hamas is essentially defeated.
I think most Palestinian's want their own nation; at this point they really have no choice either way now that Hamas is essentially defeated.
Yes, they want their own nation, but they want ALL of the land available. They don't want Israel to exist in any shape or form. IMO, the real reason that Arafat turned down peace deals and a two-state solution is because he would have been seen as a traitor, having made peace with Israel and would have been assassinated. Anyone else representing the Palestinians would have to take the same risk.
I'm curious as to why the British government would foist a solution onto the Palestinians that they clearly don't want. The Palestinians have had multiple opportunities for statehood and a two-state solution before and turned them all down.
I'll be curious when I read objections to UK/France/etc recognising Palestine from the Palestinian community.
I'm not curious about your curiosity
That line has already worn thin. You are a committed genocidal zionist.
But yes I mean who is going to come to the defense of the people of Gaza??? It is morally warranted at this point. We have American military personnel who have no connection to Israel or Palestine, who are neutral people who have been on the ground in Gaza and who have witnessed war crimes by the IDF. One of them a colonel in the US Army was removed from his position for crit
The Green beret guy never filed any report or took any evidence of these so called crimes. Just as this has supposedly been going on for weeks on end (IDF soldiers killing civilians in food lines) and no one has been able to film any of it.
As opposed to when this kind of stuff really happens and video evidence comes out very quickly. (See the recent flare up in Syria and Thailand)
Several people involved in the organization on the ground, Americans and Israelis, have said he is lying and he was fired for poor performance. There is also reports coming out he was a poor performer in the army and by the end was given a desk job as no one wanted to work with him in the field (do with this information as you may).
So either he is telling the truth and this is a giant cover up going all the way up to Trump/Hegswith/Rubio; or he is lying.
