Pre flop check up posts.
Pre flop check up posts.
8
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Pre flop check up posts.

I thought it would be helpful to start an ongoing thread where people can post pre flop situations they have questions a

20 December 2014 at 05:07 PM
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427 Replies

8
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by madrabbit m

Thanks - I suspect that this is the thing I am really needing to adjust to, as if results are drawn uniformly from {-1, -1, -1, +4} it's plus-EV but a brief unlucky streak can be a pretty long string of losses. My 8/16 games are still pretty loose-passive, just with more raising (versus the none I saw at 3/6) and more willingness to call down with second pair so going massive

if no one raised your flop bet and you are going to call one bet anyway on the turn id just bet the AK myself and obv fold to a raise so my hand isnt obvious.


8/16 game, some 3 betting, blinds tend to defend. Bad player open limps from MP, folds to me, I am OTB with K6s. SB is a loose but decent player, capable of 3 B fairly wide. BB is a solid TAG who does not over defend.

Raise or fold? K9s is raise for me here. I think K6s may be too weak.


Same 8/16 game as above, KTs UTG. Assume there is some kind of HH promo going. Open or fold?


by killians3 m

8/16 game, some 3 betting, blinds tend to defend. Bad player open limps from MP, folds to me, I am OTB with K6s. SB is a loose but decent player, capable of 3 B fairly wide. BB is a solid TAG who does not over defend.

Raise or fold K9s is raise for me here. I think K6s may be too weak.

i think you can go as low as K7s here so your intuition is right


by killians3 m

Same 8/16 game as above, KTs UTG. Assume there is some kind of HH promo going. Open or fold

raise


by killians3 m

8/16 game, some 3 betting, blinds tend to defend. Bad player open limps from MP, folds to me, I am OTB with K6s. SB is a loose but decent player, capable of 3 B fairly wide. BB is a solid TAG who does not over defend.

Raise or fold K9s is raise for me here. I think K6s may be too weak.

by killians3 m

Same 8/16 game as above, KTs UTG. Assume there is some kind of HH promo going. Open or fold

I could see all three options with K6s, doubt there's much difference in EV. K9s is always a raise OTB regardless of number of limpers.

KTs UTG is definitely a raise regardless of promotions.


4 8 8 handed. 2 limps to me in the CO with 88. BTN and SB have a fold button, BB likely to call. I raise.


4 8 game folds to meh TAG in the CO/BTN who raises...SB folds, I am in the BB with 33. 3 bet? 66. 3 bet?


If he’s the type of Tag that has no check back range on the flop I still like the somewhat antiquated strategy of calling everything and not splitting ranges.

But I mean I think 33 is clearly a call. I would probably 3bet 77+ if I was splitting ranges.


I prefer calling from the big blind against a raiser in a heads up scenario regardless of what I have and play accordingly. If you three bet with pocket threes, don’t flop a set, and are raised OTF you’re in an awkward spot.


by bruce m

I prefer calling from the big blind against a raiser in a heads up scenario regardless of what I have and play accordingly. If you three bet with pocket threes, don’t flop a set, and are raised OTF you’re in an awkward spot.

SO you defend 100% against a raise HU? Tight player UTG raiser and defend everything?


by killians3 m

SO you defend 100% against a raise HU Tight player UTG raiser and defend everything

That’s not what he meant. He meant if he continues, it’s always with a call and not a 3bet.

Keep in mind there are certain players that cbet 100% in HU spots as the preflop raiser, but there are also players that have checkback ranges. If you’re playing against someone that can check back you’re giving up a lot of value and bluff potential by not splitting ranges.


I think you can have a split strategy but without giving too much information about the strength of your hand. Base it on the likely strength of the other guy's hand.

If he is a very tight opener from any position, always just call preflop. If he's a very loose aggressive preflop raiser, 3-bet at least most of the hands you want to play.

If he isn't a rock or a maniac, but is positionally aware, and he open raises in early position, he should have a very strong hand, so just call.
If he open raises you from a late position, there's a good chance he has a weaker hand, so take initiative and 3-bet nearly every hand you want to defend.


by bruce m

I prefer calling from the big blind against a raiser in a heads up scenario regardless of what I have and play accordingly. If you three bet with pocket threes, don't flop a set, and are raised OTF you're in an awkward spot.

I agree with this. It also makes it tough to attack a lot of flop textures when you have a split range. I can see the utility of having a split range against people who have a check back range, but I tend to think that having a donking range on the flop is a better countermeasure than splitting your range PF.


4/8 or 8/16 game where players limp with AX broadway routinely.(and sometimes 99, QQ, etc.)

2 limpers to you OTB with A9o.

3 limpers to you in SB with A6o.


If blinds are tight I’m raising A9o, don’t hate a fold either. Never limping.

Easy complete with A6o.


A9o with two limpers and probably both blinds playing is a tough hand to play especially in a small limit game and I’d probably fold but I think it’s pretty close either calling or even raising too.

Complete the small blind


by bruce m

A9o with two limpers and probably both blinds playing is a tough hand to play especially in a small limit game and I'd probably fold but I think it's pretty close either calling or even raising too.

Complete the small blind

I would raise A9o after one limper and fold after two. If the blinds are ultra tight I could be persuaded to raise, but that will so rarely be the case.

Agree that A6o is a very easy complete.


8/16 8 handed. table is fairly loose, 4-5 seeing flops raised pre is typical.

EP raise, BTN and SB call, I have T4s in BB. I call

Similar situation I am in BB with Q6s. I call

BTN straddle from loose younger guy. SB is loose old asian guy, BB is tighter old asian lady, UTG is LAG ish MA asian guy.

SB call, BB calls, UTG raises, UTG +1 I look at 66 lose my mind and 4!


I think the BB hands are standard, curious to see if chill would fold as he seems to be on the tight side from the blinds.

On the 66 hand, unless the raiser's range is super tight, I don't think a 4 bet is a mistake. In bigger games it's almost certainly a mistake not to 4 bet this. If the flop is 4+ ways you've got plenty of equity, but it will probably be more than 4 ways as these types of hands draw in callers with crap just to play a massive pot. If everybody miraculously folds then you're heads up in position with a lot of dead money in the pot.


by ntnBO m

On the 66 hand, unless the raiser's range is super tight, I don't think a 4 bet is a mistake. In bigger games it's almost certainly a mistake not to 4 bet this. If the flop is 4+ ways you've got plenty of equity, but it will probably be more than 4 ways as these types of hands draw in callers with crap just to play a massive pot. If everybody miraculously folds then you're h

Thx. I am going to make a separate post about this hand.


Yeah, I would generally fold those hands in the BB. I don't hate a call from someone who knows what they're doing, but I really think non-expert trying to win should fold them.

I've never capped it with 66, but I've also never played in a limit game with a button straddle. Very weird, has anyone else seen this? Is the 4bet a cap, or can it go 5 bets when straddled?


by chillrob m

Yeah, I would generally fold those hands in the BB. I don't hate a call from someone who knows what they're doing, but I really think non-expert trying to win should fold them.

I've never capped it with 66, but I've also never played in a limit game with a button straddle. Very weird, has anyone else seen this? Is the 4bet a cap, or can it go 5 bets when straddled?

It can go to 5 with the straddle. I was borderline tilt-frustrated at this point in the session and futilely trying to iso the LAG. And I am definitely a non expert trying to win.


ive experimented with calling stuff like 92s, T3s etc in the BB after a raise.

ive found that its actually pretty hard to play them 4 way as you get in weird spots.

however once you get to 5 way i find it easier as the more players in the pot means the more clear the flop/turn actions should be.

so id say, fold 93s in BB if its going to be 4 way, and call if its going to 5 way plus.


by killians3 m

8/16 8 handed. table is fairly loose, 4-5 seeing flops raised pre is typical.

EP raise, BTN and SB call, I have T4s in BB. I call

Similar situation I am in BB with Q6s. I call

BTN straddle from loose younger guy. SB is loose old asian guy, BB is tighter old asian lady, UTG is LAG ish MA asian guy.

SB call, BB calls, UTG raises, UTG +1 I look at 66 lose my mind and 4!

Q6s just has more equity than T4s. T4s is borderline, Q6s is squarely in a call range.

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