British Politics
Been on holiday for a few weeks, surprised to find no general discussion of British politics so though I'd kick one off.
Tory leadership contest is quickly turning into farce. Trump has backed Boris, which should be reason enough for anyone with half a brain to exclude him.
Of the other candidates Rory Stewart looks the best of the outsiders. Surprised to see Cleverly and Javid not further up the betting, but not sure the Tory membership are ready for a brown PM.
https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/bri...
Regarding the LD leadership contest, Jo Swinson is miles ahead of any other candidate (and indeed any of the Tory lot). Should be a shoe in.
Finally, it's Groundhog Day in Labour - the more serious the anti-Semitism claims get, the more Corbyn's cronies write their own obituary by blaming it on outlandish conspiracy theories - this week, it's apparently the Jewish Embassy's fault...
wont someone think of the children
It's all becoming clear now.
Hope he told them to **** right off and it would explain a lot if he did.
where does sending the novichok sample to putin so that he can run the tests factor in to this latest anti-corbyn conspiracy
Nonsense.
Now for some more hilarity from the next MP for some shithole constituency in Essex populated mainly with racist ex-East Enders who didn't want to live near immigrants:
Nigel Farage has praised the misogynist influencer Andrew Tate for being an “important voice” for the emasculated and giving boys “perhaps a bit of confidence at school” in online interviews that appear to be aimed at young men over the past year.
The Reform UK leader spoke in favour of Tate for defending “male culture” in a Strike It Big podcast that aired in February, while acknowledging that the influencer had gone “over the top” and elsewhere that he had said some “pretty horrible” things.
Since December 2022, Tate has been facing charges in Romania of human trafficking, rape, and forming a criminal gang to sexually exploit women, which he denies.
Many politicians and teachers have spoken out against Tate’s influence on young boys in the UK, after the self-proclaimed misogynist said women belonged in the home and were a man’s property. “There’s no way you can be rooted in reality and not be sexist,” Tate said in one video.
In other clips reported by the Observer, the British-American kickboxer – who poses with fast cars and guns, and portrays himself as a cigar-smoking playboy – talks about hitting and choking women, trashing their belongings and stopping them from going out. He has now been banned from YouTube, Instagram, Facebook and TikTok.
Tory government from 2010 to 2024 worse than any other in postwar history, says study by leading experts
As John Stevens reports in a story for the Daily Mirror today, Jeremy Hunt, the chancellor, was complaining at a private Tory dinner earlier this year about the electorate’s “total failure to appreciate our superb record since 2010”.
But just how good is the Conservative party’s record in government over the past 14 years? Thankfully, we now have what is as close as we’re going to get to the authoritative, official verdict. Sir Anthony Seldon, arguably Britain’s leading contemporary political historian, is publishing a collection of essays written by prominent academics and other experts and they have analysed the record of the Conservative government from 2010 to 2024, looking at what it has achieved in every area of policy.
It is called The Conservative Effect 2010-2024: 14 Wasted Years? and it is published by Cambridge University Press.
And its conclusion is damning. It describes this as the worst government in postwar history.
Here is the conclusion of the final chapter, written by Seldon and his co-editor Tom Egerton, which sums up the overall verdict.
In comparison to the earlier four periods of one-party dominance post-1945, it is hard to see the years since 2010 as anything but disappointing. By 2024, Britain’s standing in the world was lower, the union was less strong, the country less equal, the population less well protected, growth more sluggish with the outlook poor, public services underperforming and largely unreformed, while respect for the institutions of the British state, including the civil service, judiciary and the police, was lower, as it was for external bodies, including the universities and the BBC, repeatedly attacked not least by government, ministers and right-wing commentators.
Do the unusually high number of external shocks to some extent let the governments off the hook? One above all – Brexit – was entirely of its own making and will be seen in history as the defining decision of these years. In 2024, the verdict on Brexit is almost entirely negative, with those who are suffering the most from it, as sceptics at the time predicted, the most vulnerable. The nation was certainly difficult to rule in these fourteen years, the Conservative party still more so. Longstanding problems certainly contributed to the difficulties the prime minister faced in providing clear strategic policy, including the 24-hour news cycle, the rise of social media and AI, and the frequency of scandals and crises. But it was the decision of the prime minister to choose to be distracted by the short term, rather than focusing on the strategic and the long term. The prime minister has agency: the incumbents often overlooked it.
Overall, it is hard to find a comparable period in history of a Conservative, or other, government which achieved so little, or which left the country at its conclusion in a more troubling state.
In their concluding essay, Seldon and Egerton argue that poor leadership was one of the main problems with the 14-year administration. They say that Boris Johnson and Liz Truss were “not up to the job” of being prime minister, and they have a low opinion of most of the other leading figures who have been in government. They say:
Very few cabinet ministers from 2010 to 2024 could hold a candle to the team who served under Clement Attlee – which included Ernest Bevin, Nye Bevan, Stafford Cripps, Hugh Gaitskell and Herbert Morrison. Or the teams who served under Wilson, Thatcher or Blair. Michael Gove, Jeremy Hunt and Philip Hammond were rare examples of ministers of quality after 2010 …
A strong and capable prime minister is essential to governmental success in the British system. The earlier four periods saw two historic and landmark prime ministers, ie Churchill and Thatcher, with a succession of others who were capable if not agenda-changing PMs, including Macmillan, Wilson, Major and Blair. Since 2010, only Cameron came close to that level, with Sunak the best of the rest. Policy virtually stopped under May as Brexit consumed almost all the machine’s time, while serious policymaking ground to a halt under Johnson’s inept leadership, the worst in modern premiership, and the hapless Truss. Continuity of policy was not helped by each incoming prime minister despising their predecessor, with Truss’s admiration for Johnson the only exception. Thus they took next no time to understand what it was their predecessors were trying to do, and how to build on it rather than destroy it.
Seldon’s first book, published 40 years ago, was about Churchill’s postwar administration, and he has been editing similar collections of essays studying the record of administrations since Margaret Thatcher’s. He is a fair judge, and not given to making criticisms like this lightly.
The book is officially being published next week, and I’m quoting from a proof copy. In this version, the subtitle still has a question mark after 14 Wasted Years? Judging by the conclusion, that does not seem necessary.
Leftists "experts" don't like center right governments news at 11
Yes, I live in the European Union. That's why this extremist stuff about boat people escaping from the European Union seems deeply, deeply nuts from my perspective.
Not perhaps the echoes of the policies of almost every government of the world, including those of the countries which are seen as source countries for migrants, which also deport people who arrive without visas
Which countries of the world do you think would or wouldn't be justified in "sending you back" if you decided to migrate there without their prior agreement?
I think it's mainly a language or family thing. If they were French speakers or had family there they'd want to settle in France I guess. What is deeply, deeply nuts is that people voted for Brexit mainly to control immigration and even that part of it has been a spectacular failure. Also deeply, deeply nuts is the UK's foreign policy being responsible for many of those displaced people and the UK now being unwilling to offer them a home. Turns out there's a cost to painting a quarter of the world pink.
I didn't think we were talking about people from safe countries trying to migrate in contravention of immigration law in the target country.
There is no nationwide war in sub Saharan Africa. There are areas of some nations with problems, and people living there can move to... Other areas of the same country.
Afaik the UK has accepted a lot of Ukraine refugees (those are fleeing an actual war)
I wonder why we aren't hearing much from the left-leaning people who like (pretend to, when it's convenient for them ) proportional representation this cycle...
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Leftists don't like Starmer's Labour and you're not making any sense.
I wonder why we aren't hearing much from the left-leaning people who like (pretend to, when it's convenient for them ) proportional representation this cycle...
I am a left leaning person and I still believe that we should move to a proportional system. Not full PR like the Dutch/Israel, but I think either STV or AMS would be best.
Not surprising, as PR has been the core policy of the Liberal, SDP and now Lib Dem party, all of which have called themselves left-leaning despite jumping into bed with Cameron and backing austerity.
I wonder why we aren't hearing much from the left-leaning people who like (pretend to, when it's convenient for them ) proportional representation this cycle...
I don’t think Labour as a party have ever been particularly pro PR. The Labour membership have voted in favour of PR I think, but were basically ignored by the leadership.
I presume Lib Dem’s and Greens are just as pro PR as ever, but they won’t get anywhere with it. Perhaps they could form some weird alliance with Reform.
For what it’s worth I’ve always been pro FPTP precisely because it makes it very difficult for fringe parties to get anywhere.
I do find it odd when real leftist (ie left of Labour) types advocate for PR. It’s far more likely to help the far right than it is to help them.
For what it’s worth I’ve always been pro FPTP precisely because it makes it very difficult for fringe parties to get anywhere.
It's a "forever problem" which has no first best solutions with exceptionally costly tradeoffs whatever you choose to do as a polity.
Endless pages have been written on it and at the end you will decide based on the outcomes you prefer like you are noting here (i prefer full PR because it leads to lower chances of extreme changes following an election for example).
But one thing is important and it's that imho it shouldn't be something that simple majorities can change. In italy basically every parliament can tweak the electoral law to favour previous winners of elections and that can't be something positive.
SNP are so skint that their staffers have been reduced to discussing whether stamps intended for parliamentary business can be traced back to them if they use them for campaign materials. Wonder where all that money went…
It's a "forever problem" which has no first best solutions with exceptionally costly tradeoffs whatever you choose to do as a polity.
Endless pages have been written on it and at the end you will decide based on the outcomes you prefer like you are noting here (i prefer full PR because it leads to lower chances of extreme changes following an election for example).
But one thing is important and it's that imho it shouldn't be something that simple majorities can change. In italy basically every pa
Yep, I agree with all of this.
I do find it odd when real leftist (ie left of Labour) types advocate for PR. It’s far more likely to help the far right than it is to help them.
STV is fine but anything with party list is a democratic catastrophe
The push for PR is part of the massive lie that votes are wasted if you don't vote for the main parties.
STV is fine but anything with party list is a democratic catastrophe
The push for PR is part of the massive lie that votes are wasted if you don't vote for the main parties.
The push for PR is about not relying on "currents" and teams and caucuses inside a party to form ever changing majorities about topics, rather allowing you say to vote the greenest party possible, have a seat (or more( in parliament and being basically guaranteed that seat will be used for green policies as much as possible.
Much more direct than say signaling the main parties you like green policies then letting their representatives decide if and how much to give a **** about your vote 4 or 5 years from now.
In Italy rn for example if you were center right you could have chosen between immigration as the main issue, federalism+immigration as the main issue (with skepticism about Ukraine), or federalism and tax reduction and pro Ukraine.
That's quite a detailed way to express your vote in a way that matters immediately
You get more by voting for a small party that represents your issues in first past the post