Israel/Palestine thread

the system works. no health care and tons of genocide is good actually.

You guys have it backwards. Thinking like yours is what gets us in this mess, not the other way around.

Give me the iterated problem and I can show you why you’re just getting the event space wrong. The problem usually starts before the general election, and thus trying to fix the problem in the general election is wrongheaded.

It’s like not wanting to get your car fixed from the damage to forgetting to get the oil change because you think you should have put oil in the car in the first place to avoid the mess.

If we are expanding the event space beyond the voting booth, then I would just proffer other expansions until eventually we get to the mathematical truth that ignoring which option is most preferred or least bad in favor of only voting for idealized candidates is irrational.

In this case, it has very real world effects on Gazans. Let’s accept that Kamala is the hitler of Palestinians. By not voting for her you let turbo hitler win. It is better to vote for hitler over turbo hitler. This is just borne out in the data. We can formalize it if you want but the point seems obvious to me.

The only way to get out of the dilemma is by proposing that you have no preference whatsoever. Well then we can just perform a conceptual analysis of the outcomes of each stance to see if that would be conceptually true.

Victor kinda likes Trump, though, and Trump likes Victor's poster-boy Putin, so that's all good, apparently.

No. What happens before the election is dictated in large part in how they expect us to vote at elections. Which is dictated by how people vote.

It's actually an explicit strategy (voiced by the like of Peter Mandelson who didn't invent it) to take for granted left wing voters because they will vote laregly for least worst. That's why they developed being not quite as as the other lot to maximise the vote.

If we want good candidates then they have to know we wont vote for bad ones. You insist we should vote for bad ones if the others are worse. It's a catastrophie. They are desperate for our votes and you just give it away.

edit: As apparantly you like to think mathematical terms. As a very basic start, if we put it on scale of 1 to 10 where 10 is good and 1 is bad then vs a 3 you are optimising the vote for a 4.

I dont like Trump or Putin. when I say they are just as bad as Biden and the genocidal Dems, that is not an endorsement.

this is very hard for Americans liberals to understand bc they think if the Dems were in charge then everything would be fine. but we saw what the Dems did in Gaza and Ukraine and Yemen and many other places.

Yeah, for sure. Not voting at all is definitely the best way to have your interests represented.

It's certainly better than voting against your interests

Can’t argue with that!

You are justifying Canadian politicians actions. That is orthogonal to my point. The point is Trump's base has no inherent animus against Canadians. It is all a response to Canadian actions and rhetoric (that you find perfectly justified given Trump's own rhetoric and actions*).

And again, the fact there is almost no "Mexico hating" (despite the fact you would think so-called "white supremacists" would find a non white nation lead by a Marxist Jews a much more compelling target) underscores this point.

*It should also be noted all of Trumps rhetoric against Canada seems to be originating from his own personal proclivities. There is nothing in the "right wing" playbook about attacking Canada. It seems to be completely from his own personal proclivities and economic priorities.

C. Convinced not voting for their ranked choice preference is somehow better than than doing so for some unknown reason.

if they don't vote they admit to know nothing about politics and that the voting population would make a better choice than they could, simple as that.

it's a humble admission of utter ignorance, you have to respect that.

Boids and Karl are going to take short breaks. There are still lines we’re not going to cross here, even with the lighter restrictions, and those include mocking people with medical conditions like autism, and telling people to kill themselves.

Act like real people, or leave.

The reasons aren’t unknown. Foreign nation states have a known and active interest in fermenting distrust between westerners and their governing bodies.

The stark rise in highly divisive and polarizing political takes isn’t organic.

lol

As I have said before, protesting Hamas is extremely costly for Palestinians, as it is very likely you will be tortured and murdered. It is also very unfortunate that the rest of the world cynically supports such behavior with their silence.

But everyone has a price, and the Western world has been bought and payed for by Jihadi oil, money and propaganda.

It is what it is.

I’d have less of a problem with people like that. People who simply don’t know if things would be better with universal healthcare or if we eliminated Medicare and Medicaid. But those are not the non voters we’re talking about.

Speaking of child murderers, are you pro abortion?

Wtf man ….
That president attack Canada frontier and economy .
W.e you believe beside that I can’t help you with ….
Pretty dumb if you to believe Canada would not react tho.

And here’s is an example how Canadian politicians “hates” Americans …

And please leave out the “ Canadian politicians reacted so badly” while trump constantly speak with incredibly insulting and threatening comments about almost anything to anyone ….

Why don’t you look into your own backyards before blaming others …

Ps: Mexico wasn’t threatened like Canada was .
Not mentioning the lies trump said that the frontier of Mexico and Canada had similar problems with the U.S. …

Thx for the common sense which seem to lack tremendously in this discussion thread …

Nope but I would bet you the gaza people will
End up in a much worse situation with trump …

And if I was living in Gaza , any improvement would be very welcome and I wouldn’t consider it to be the same shrug .
Which is what u don’t seem to understand ….

you arent wiping that stink away. we all saw what the Dems did in Gaza. just bc Trump is 1% worse doesnt make you guys right. and none of the stuff Trump is doing is unprecedented, the Dems did the same thing. nor would it even be possible if Biden and the liberal genocidaires didnt normalize bombing hospitals, executing masses of people, sniping children, using human shields and then executing them, strapping explosives on people to search houses and then blowing them up, burning people alive, burying people alive, raping people to death, running concentration camps, torturing prisoners to death, starving people to death, literally murdering babies on incubators.

the list goes on. but all of that stuff happened at a level we have not seen in history with the full blessing and support of the Democrats.

so what you dont understand is reality. you dont understand that the Dems support genocide, which is a term that doesnt even do justice to the depraved atrocities that they just committed for over a year and then handed the baton to Trump to do the same wickedness.

you arent wiping that stink off. Dems own this and no one will forget it.

I'm saying the reasons are "unknown" in that whatever they are they cannot make any sense. "Could have voted but chose not to" beats every candidate in every election. The notion that it makes sense for someone unhappy with the status quo to not vote is laughable because that's already the most common behavior that over the last 40+ years has led to the current status quo.

if you are unhappy with the status quo, then ecriture, a very smart person, just ask him, says to vote for the people doing the status quo. this is just physics or math or something.

IN other news Hamas has publicly admitted to torturing and murdering 6 Palestinian "collaborators." Obviously this was done with the utmost publicity and cruelty to send a message to the Palestinian people they are nothing but expendable human shields, and have no rights or voice.

Of course Hamas is also aware the Ummah has no liberal values to speak of, and the West has been bought and paid for a long time ago; so they dont have to worry about any push back for such inhumane, deplorable behavior.

Those poor souls. I wonder if our resident virtue signalers will chime in on this. Just pure evil.