Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
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What would be the "world war"? i never get it when people claim that's the risk for Ukraine or for the middle east.
There is no meaningful world war if there isn't an USA vs China direct military confrontation.
Only Taiwan issues could potentially trigger a world war
Once countries start taking sides everyone tends to get involved. That's why they call it a world war. We already have deeply entrenched coalitions of belligerents anchored by nuclear powers. That's all the ingredients required. War has a way of spilling over and forcing countries not currently involved to take a side. And the first world war taught us that there doesn't even have to be anything at risk or some clear moral imperative.
Once countries start taking sides everyone tends to get involved. That's why they call it a world war. We already have deeply entrenched coalitions of belligerents anchored by nuclear powers. That's all the ingredients required. War has a way of spilling over and forcing countries not currently involved to take a side. And the first world war taught us that there doesn't even have to be anything at risk or some clear moral imperative.
No man only if China is on the other side then you are right. Both world war were such because the biggest economies in the world went against each other, if it's the biggest vs some small portion of the world that is just a one side massacre
I was pretty sure this post would not get any response and it didn't. The media pretty much ignores Israeli crimes against humanity. What blows my mind is that it's not as though the only problem is that the media doesn't cover it, but that consumers of media learn what type of stories they are supposed to care about and which ones they aren't. It's not like "oh I would have liked to have known about that war crime but I was failed by the media institutions". There is actually something learned in the patterns of coverage, something like "Non whites aren't human and any amount of suffering they endure means nothing to me".
This is the "rules based international order" folks, bombing orphanages is allowed as long as there are no white kids in them.
It's good to know that as the winsdcreens melt and the tears evaporate, we will to our last breathes be arguing about whether it counts as a world war or not.
I was pretty sure this post would not get any response and it didn't. The media pretty much ignores Israeli crimes against humanity. What blows my mind is that it's not as though the only problem is that the media doesn't cover it, but that consumers of media learn what type of stories they are supposed to care about and which ones they aren't. It's not like "oh I would have liked to have known about that war crime but I was failed by the media institutions". There is actually something learned
totally agree ofc.
and also, most liberals dont even want to hear about it. in the Election Thread, the partisan Dems supporters ridicule the idea that the Biden Admin is an active participant one of the greatest crimes of our lifetime. bring it up a few times and they will tell you to leave the thread or make fun of it. and UP has barely a mention of it.
its absurd to me to watch people fearmonger about Trump while our govt is blowing kids to bits by the truckload, engaging in some of the worst libelous atrocity propaganda ever, and doing everything it can to start a massive war with Iran.
and then even domestically, the party that likes to pretend to support civil rights is using militant police to stifle any dissent and passing insane laws to limit or ban criticism of Israel. Cornell is about to deport a student for supporting Palestine and I am old enough to remember the Dems threw a fit over the "Muslim ban".
Read the reports for YEARS now on the ring of fire. Iran has been provoking everyone for over a decade. They just found a very clever way to do it from behind other armies. But those provocations aren't any less real.
Who would even care about Iran if not for the proxies? Truly, why waste the time and money? The world has better things to do. The UAE produces 75% as much oil. Does anyone care to fight them? No. Because they aren't doing what Iran very clearly is.
Believe it or not, Israel and everyone else, have better things to do.
Bad.
Now do the count for Islamophobic incidents and people having marches aimed at non-Jewish immigrants. Intolerance is on the increase across the board.
It's good to know that as the winsdcreens melt and the tears evaporate, we will to our last breathes be arguing abo.ut whether it counts as a world war or not.
You can rest assured it most certainly won't be any fault of America's. The US will write the history of WW3 because it will be left in control of the internet and media.
Israeli paper Yedioth Ahronoth is reporting disaster after disaster for this invasion.
Read the reports for YEARS now on the ring of fire. Iran has been provoking everyone for over a decade. They just found a very clever way to do it from behind other armies. But those provocations aren't any less real.
Both sides have been engaging in endless tit-for-tat provocations for decades. Hang on, let me write that in all-caps: Both sides have been ENGAGING in endless PROVOCATIONS for DECADES. Recently, Israel/USA have firebombed refugee camps, assassinated a general, launched a ground invasion of a neighbor state, and all but declared war. To say nothing of the USA overthrowing the Iranian government in 1979. Iran has had all the excuse it could want to declare war and it hasn't. It's been astonishingly patient despite all the provocations. So please, stop pretending that Israel was just sitting around minding its own business when the bloodthirsty Iranians decided to start some **** for no reason.
Having to side against Israel on everything has some people’s world views all mixed up. Wow.
North Korea says **** like that all the damn time, mostly we just laugh it off. I wouldn't support a full blown war on bluster alone.
And NK could leave Iran a bloody mess if they wanted to. To us, we let NK threaten us with their missiles so they can impress their girlfriends.
There are threats everywhere of all degrees facing every country, alwayshasbeenjpeg...and biting your lip is often necessary, as well as understanding your opponents perspective.
wonder how this will compare to Sheryl Sandberg thing in terms of credibility
It's good to know that as the winsdcreens melt and the tears evaporate, we will to our last breathes be arguing about whether it counts as a world war or not.
Hm no wait, if I am right it means there is no conscription for any EU country, or for the UK for that matter.
And no significant problem at home for us.
In which case no matter if 1m or 100m Iranians die, that's not a world war.
Is masses of citizens of first world countries don't get slaughtered it isn't a world war.
And NK could leave Iran a bloody mess if they wanted to. To us, we let NK threaten us with their missiles so they can impress their girlfriends.
There are threats everywhere of all degrees facing every country, alwayshasbeenjpeg...and biting your lip is often necessary, as well as understanding your opponents perspective.
Are you suggesting that Iran has merely been issuing threats? They’ve been actively attacking Israel through their proxies for a year now. I don’t think it’s very honest to compare Iran and NK here.
I was pretty sure this post would not get any response and it didn't. The media pretty much ignores Israeli crimes against humanity. What blows my mind is that it's not as though the only problem is that the media doesn't cover it, but that consumers of media learn what type of stories they are supposed to care about and which ones they aren't. It's not like "oh I would have liked to have known about that war crime but I was failed by the media institutions". There is actually something learned
There are “non-whites” dying all over the world but you don’t care. Spare us.
Are you suggesting that Iran has merely been issuing threats? They’ve been actively attacking Israel through their proxies for a year now. I don’t think it’s very honest to compare Iran and NK here.
Right, but their proxies got curb stomped and their proxies had a latitude of self determination and self-governance that "potentially" strengthens Iran. But they were just awful.
Now with their proxies set back, how serious is a short term threat directly from Iran?
Is the threat large enough to escalate and dramatically increase civilian death in order to reduce it? And how exactly does escalation with Iran accomplish that?
Right, but their proxies got curb stomped and their proxies had a latitude of self determination and self-governance that "potentially" strengthens Iran. But they were just awful.
Now with their proxies set back, how serious is a short term threat directly from Iran?
Is the threat large enough to escalate and dramatically increase civilian death in order to reduce it? And how exactly does escalation with Iran accomplish that?
The proxies getting “curb stomped” is debatable. Hezbollah is still a huge threat, the Houthis haven't faced any repercussions, and Hamas is still fighting back to some degree.
I do see what you’re saying though and personally I’m not hoping for a big ground invasion. I’m assuming Israel’s goal is mainly to neutralize Hezbollah’s capability to shell the north and not enter into a drawn out campaign. I’m not an expert so idk how that would work. We’re all obviously hoping there are reasonable and informed people behind Bibi and this isn’t all just his personal scheme. I do think Israel has shown recently that their intel and decision making revolving around dealing with Hezbollah has been top notch.
Leveling apartment towers in the Dahiyeh isn't even worth mentioning now bc it's so common. So now Israel is bombing the central downtown areas of Beirut and not just the ole Hezbollah stronghold.
Why don't Iran, Hezbollah, Houtis, and Hamas fire their rockets at the settlements in the West Bank? Why are they firing their weapons at innocent people?
