Israel/Palestine thread
Think this merits its own thread...
Discuss my fellow 2+2ers..
AM YISRAEL CHAI.
[QUOTE=Crossnerd]Edit: RULES FOR THIS THREAD
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Russia sends troops into Ukraine amirite
https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ukrain...
Russia Sends More Troops Into Ukraine's Crimea: Report
There is a tipping point at which Hezbollah is so weak that Lebanon is rid of them. That is the dream.
In fact we are looking at the possibility of a total shift from radicalism in the middle east, if the Iranian proxies are weakened enough. I would imagine there is a second phase in place to start helping the moderate elements take these countries back.
If LAF can actually hold the areas that IDF clear then that would be a major start. I'm not sure that this will actually happen, but obviously hoping for the best. A major component of this would then be that IDF stops all bombing.
Fantasy land
It was a reply to the post above it suggesting that western media is biased in how they portray Russia's invasion vs Israel's.
Yep sorry. I realised and deleted
agree. Israel will never "grant" a state. the West has never "granted" anything to the people they oppress, enslave, murder, rape, and steal from. freedom is only taken by force like in Algeria, Korea, Vietnam, South Africa, India.
Just wanted to add the U.S. to your list. Maybe one day we can all stop pretending that anything other than violence moves the needle. Even getting black people the right to vote took violence. Most people think that MLK and his nonviolent tactics won it. That's false. MLK was the leader the establishment decided to negotiate with after the violence started. Same with Gandhi.
Just wanted to add the U.S. to your list. Maybe one day we can all stop pretending that anything other than violence moves the needle. Even getting black people the right to vote took violence. Most people think that MLK and his nonviolent tactics won it. That's false. MLK was the leader the establishment decided to negotiate with after the violence started. Same with Gandhi.
The violence has been going on 11 months. Which leader do you think Israel is going to start negotiating with? Seems to me Israel is content just assassinating all the leaders of the insurgents who have chosen violence. But maybe I am missing something.
Israelis claim thousands of years ago people they, by now, have scant genetic relationship to, used to live somewhere and, hence, they have the right to take it over now.
So do we just apply this logic globally? Maybe the Europeans who claim Israel as theirs did have ancestors there thousands of years ago. Maybe they didn't. Some say they actually came from some other place. We can't ever know for sure. But we're sure pretty sure about the out-of-Africa hypothesis. So can anyone just go to Africa, plant themselves in someone's house and declare that house as their own? Will the U.S. government back up that claim?
If I had a home in Africa I'd be a little nervous as everyone can claim to have ancestral footprints into my house. Plus my community can suffer genocide and the perpetrator can go the U.N. and receive a warm welcome even after an international court has indicted them.
Can we use 23andME to find out where our genes were and then just go there are displace the residents? I don't see what is so special about the Israelis. Why do only they get to do this?
The violence has been going on 11 months. Which leader do you think Israel is going to start negotiating with? Seems to me Israel is content just assassinating all the leaders of the insurgents who have chosen violence. But maybe I am missing something.
There really is no negotiating with a bunch of known liars. The Palestinian problem is they don't have enough violence to apply in the right place. That is the lesson being taught now, and learned.
Violence really isn't a choice when facing the kind of oppression the Palestinians have. It's the only rational response. Peaceful protests haven't accomplished anything except more violence from Israel.
Israelis claim thousands of years ago people they, by now, have scant genetic relationship to, used to live somewhere and, hence, they have the right to take it over now.
So do we just apply this logic globally? Maybe the Europeans who claim Israel as theirs did have ancestors there thousands of years ago. Maybe they didn't. Some say they actually came from some other place. We can't ever know for sure. But we're sure pretty sure about the out-of-Africa hypothesis. So can anyone just go to Africa
I dont care about "blood and sand" arguments. Israel has the right to exist because the people that have been trying to destroy them the last 80 years have failed. And if they think the next 80 years are going to go any better, then they better hope Paradise has a lot of vacancies, because it is going to need them.
The same as if some Native American said you were living on their ancestral land and should give it back, you would tell them to go **** themselves, and the force of the US state would back you up if they tried to resort to violence.
There really is no negotiating with a bunch of known liars. The Palestinian problem is they don't have enough violence to apply in the right place. That is the lesson being taught now, and learned.
Violence really isn't a choice when facing the kind of oppression the Palestinians have. It's the only rational response. Peaceful protests haven't accomplished anything except more violence from Israel.
Or the Palestinians could just move on and make the best of things, like pretty much everyone else has had to do the over the last 1 million years or so. You could name 100 situations similar to this one over the last 100 years, including several ongoing, where the population that lost just had to move on.
The Pakistan govt just evicted 2 million ethnic Afghanis. Went into their towns with bulldozers, destroyed everything, and told them to start walking to the border, and dont stop until they cross it. Should the rest of the world be funding an insurgency for them to retake the villages?
The irony is the land the proposed "Palestinian state" would reside on is mostly inhospitable wasteland with no natural resources, and with climate change it is only going to get worse. Israel makes it work because of extremely advanced technology. And who knows how long this is sustainable.
The idea that any low technology, uneducated, high birthrate, politically unstable population should be trying to form a densely populated theocratic ethnostate on this land is kind of absurd and seems doomed to failure even under the best of circumstances, which this surely is not.
The idea that any low technology, uneducated, high birthrate, politically unstable population should be trying to form a densely populated theocratic ethnostate on this land is kind of absurd and seems doomed to failure even under the best of circumstances, which this surely is not.
This is a pretty self-defeating line of thought. Compared to developing nations which are in a similar situation Palestine has high literacy rates. World Bank puts their literacy rate at 97%: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SE....
They value higher education, and a major factor for not receiving higher education is the lack of access being imposed upon Palestine. Using a lack of education imposed on Palestine as a justification for imposing further restrictions preventing higher education is clearly circular reasoning.
One million Lebanese displaced as war fears spike
Lebanon's Health Ministry said more than 1,000 Lebanese have been killed and at least 6,000 wounded in the past two weeks.
The government said a million people - around a fifth of the population - have fled their homes.
Reuters
A million displaced in such a short amount a time.
They tried peace. Oslo. The PLO recognized Israel and gave up the gun. Israel refused to grant a state or end the occupation, so the Intifadas began.
You are showing your implicit bias, and a lack of understanding of history, in blaming Israel for the failed accords. One can find a modicum of legitimate blame in Israel, true, but there is equal blame with the PLO. But the overwhelming majority of the blame goes to Hamas, who stated it was their goal to destroy the Oslo peace process. They succeeded. No matter what the PLO said, did, or offered, had any chance of succeeding as long as Hamas existed. Hamas ended up destroying the legitimacy and political strength of the PLO. No matter what Israel said, did or offered had any chance of succeeding as long as Hamas existed, because Hamas did not want peace. Which is why Hamas must be destroyed.
Funny how Israel successfully created a peace deal with Jordan during the same timeframe as the Oslo accords. Good things happen when both sides want peace. Hamas has never, and will never, agree to peace. But, yeah, blame Israel.
The conversation aboout iran might be interesting
#عاجل �� Urgent statement to the residents of #جنوب_لبنان the following villages: Yaroun, Ain Ebel, Maroun al-Ras, Tayri, Hadatha Aita al-Jabal (al-Zat), Jmeijima, Toulin, Deir Aames, Burj Qalweyeh, al-Bayada, Zebqin Jabal al-Batm, Sarbin, al-Shaitiya, Kanisa, al-Haniyeh, Ma’rakah, Ghandouriya, Deir Qanun - Malikiyeh al-Sahel, Burj al-Shamali, Abel al-Saqi, Srifa, Deir Qanun al-Nahr, Abbasiyeh, al-Rashidiya, Bint Jbeil, Aitaroun.
⭕️ Activities #حزب_الله force the IDF to act against it. The IDF does not want to harm you, and for your own safety you must evacuate your homes immediately. Anyone who is near Hezbollah members, installations and combat equipment is putting his life in danger. Any home used by Hezbollah for its military needs is expected to be targeted.
⭕️ You must immediately head to the north of the Awali River, save your lives and evacuate your homes immediately.
⭕️ Be careful, you are not allowed to go south. Going south could put your life in danger.
⭕️ We will let you know when it is safe to return home.
I think at this point it is almost certain that the UK and USA soldiers are contributing to the genocide on the ground and by dropping bombs themselves.
You are well aware of all the rights, privileges, duties, and opportunities that millions of Arabs who live in Israel have (work, school, vote, army, etc). You know that when you stack them beside South Africa, it's not even in the same realm. AKA not apartheid.
If you mean GAZA, Gaza is not Israel. Hopefully when peace arrives, Gaza will become what it could have always been without Hamas.
������ A senior official in the White House tells me: The US has intelligence that Iran intends to launch a missile attack against Israel in the immediate time frame
