Daniel Negreanu's very own containment thread. All things Danny go here

Yeah that's insane logic. There were going to be a few poker legends made out of the poker boom. The poker boom made the legends the legends didn't make the boom.

Daniel negreanu or any other poker player wasn't pulling tons of non poker players into the game.

Accessible and widespread online poker, hole card cams, espn/televised poker made the boom. If any player needs to get gratitude it's Moneymaker but it was still going to happen without him too.

It wouldn’t have happened if the charisma free tankers were around back then.
Nobody would’ve been watching by the time moneymaker won.

Those charisma free tanker are a major part of why DN has the big endorsement contract. He is flamboyant and has personality. Even in the old days, most professional pokers were not interesting to watch, with poker faces, etc.

I know everyone here knows he would be living on the street without the endorsement contract. However, it will impress the fish GG hired him to appeal to this cash in the $250K, all the deep runs, the record for the most PGT wins, and the win in the $50K mixed games. Definitely the type of results that will keep his endorsement contract going.

After a deep dive we've uncovered the truth!

He's not gay and neither is Tim Walz.

I said Dnegs isn't gay, it's right there, in the title!

we should see how long you would last in a $250k. would be hilarious seeing you punt every hand you play lol

The day Daniel wins a wsop bracelet, plus wins money during the wsop series is the day I will shut up.

Daniel is up money this, which is a rare feat for him.

Yuuuup

It was a combination of many things. The perfect storm. No doubt if the hole card cam wasn't invented we wouldn't have had the boom.

But if pros back then were tanking anti social mis regs like the high roller players we have no poker would not have boomed the same way. The appeal of poker was that it was a fun gambling game anyone could win at.

The high rollers are a bunch of incredibly well studied dweebs who put in a ton of work trying to extract every ounce of ev they possibly can no matter how minute or how long it takes.

But in the process are miserable to play with,chased off all of the business guys from playing,and have created a race to the bottom. It's a self fulfilling prophecy where now that edges are so small you really do have to worry about every drop of ev , and do things like fank tank with 82o pre to conceal timing tells etc.

Yes DNegs was in the right place at the right time. The opportunity he had was luck. But he and other pros ran with it. But if these same guys had that opportunity back then they would have completely squandered it.

Imagine if back then instead of DNegs Helminth etc we had a masked up Ike Haxton (who absolutely is wearing that stupid thing on his face to conceal tells) tanking for 2 mins against Volegsang with a hoody covering his face before finally betting 2/9th of the pot which then sends Volegsang into the tank for 8 mins. Nobody wants to watch that **** and nobody is going to want to emulate those guys.

If instead of Moneymaker we get Tomoyo folding pocket queens (which was completely wrong but since there is no justice in the world he ends up winning) to an open at the final table , and cheating with his 2 scumbag buddies to win the main hole card cams aren't creating a boom.

cope levels in this thread have reached critical levels

I think the poker boom caused the games to be full of nerds. It was inevitable imho.

And back in the day, before the proliferation of books, training videos, coaches, etc., normal people played. A percentage of normies have personalities.

i just heard DN's quick aside during a recent vlog where a fan stopped him to say something nice and it was that DN was the "heartbeat" of the WSOP. teary-eyed millionaire, naturally, gave the "...yeah, yeah, i guess -- you know what -- I really am that guy" summary.

of course he did. if there is anything daniel loves more than himself, it is receiving compliments about himself. granted, this story was probably entirtely fabricated. but it does go to show to super-charged, fierce solipsistic nature of the man: when pointed out that he is the center of the universe, he does indeed reinforce (in his mind, and in his mind's mind of everyone else's mind) that he is indeed the center of the literal universe.

me, me, me, me.

it never ends.

I actually like Kabreal's persona more than Daniel at the table. Over the last few years Daniel has grown into a unlikeable person to me.

I honestly am inclined to believe that there was no fan making a comment. He just has barely enough self awareness to realize that if he said unprompted on stream "I am the heart beat of the WSOP" he would come off as extremely narcissistic, so he made up the fan story to give himself an excuse to say it. Probaby even he wouldnt do that ... but it wouldnt be completely out of character.

You just heard the quick aside? Ahh I’m thinking you probably watch every minute of every vlog looking to get outraged

It has gotten worse with GTO. People playing like a computer.

Also, people like that can't play high stakes NLHE cash, because the amateurs who play high stakes don't want to play with them. So high stakes NLHE is mostly private games. So all they can play high stakes is tournaments.

*GRO

What's GRO?

This thread is beyond tragic with this post a highlight, every couple days I think there might be something interesting and there never is.

You seriously need to let go and find a new hobby buddy

The guy has crushed life more than any of us could ever dream of , who cares about the semantics

Khabrel keeps on saying it busting on the high rollers

Part of the issue is that many poker operators listened to the wrong customers, those poker nerds. They would push for everything to be in their favor.

Cash games: Deeper buyins, unlimited straddles, match the stack

Tournaments: (this is really the industry and the grinders) multi-day, multi-flight, multi-bag, unlimited rebuys and top-heavy payouts

These are all things that funneled the majority of the money into the better players pockets. It's become so much harder for the recreational player to realize their dream of winning an event because they're competing with people who have the free time and bankrolls to just fire, fire, fire and take all the risks to try and chip up to have a shot for the top prize.

Most recreational players have 1 or 2 bullets, they can't come play Flights A-H all week long trying to multi-bag.

Mason Malmuth already noted in his book that there needs to be a balance between skill and luck, such that the fun, recreational players will win 1/3 of the time in cash games so they keep coming back.

Likewise, Lee Jones has spoken out against the changes to tournaments as well.

The poker rooms when they spend marketing dollars, when they offer promotions, when they structure games, they should do so with the fun, recreational players in mind, the LIFEBLOOD of poker. Without them, the grinders can't make their living. But the grinders are too short-sighted, they want every edge on their side, favoring short-term returns over long-term sustainability.

This was true online as well. I remember early on you could play maybe 3-4 tables max. Pacific poker allowed 1 table. Pros pushed for more and more tables. So the sites listened.Sites like stars and the cake poker network even rewarded mass multi tabling. Of course the bad players were all playing 1-2 tables and just getting slaughtered by the grinders and in the process getting zero action and tanking in exchange for their money.

I actually remember playing someone heads up and I looked at where he was in the prior couple of months rake races. I realized bc of the rake races and actual rake back at the volume he played he was getting over 100 percent rake back. It was possible for me to actually beat him for a small amount , but be net negative from rake while he'd actually net profit despite being down to me.